Old 3rd January 2002, 04:10   #1
iomegajaz
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Colours / et al

Okay.

I was walking along the coast road on Bribie Island with three other guys and two girls on the night of the 1st (two days ago), relaxing after the drinking the night before.

I decided that after spending a month or two getting to know these people - originally friends through my g/f, now just plain friends - they were up to discussing something a bit weightier than the weather (as most people are not, I rarely talk about such stuff. 'Cept here, of course )

1.
I started with an easy one. As humans are seen as the highest-rating being on this planet, is it our duty to protect all the creatures which dwell thereon, stop cutting down trees, preserve the "enviroment" around us, etc etc.. OR, as beings which take part in said "environment", do we therefore have the right to use it as we wish (as all animals do), and destroy it piece by piece to make our lives easier? Will we find a planet suitable to inhabit after we've completely FUCKZORED Earth, or will we advance far enough with genetic engineering to enable us to survive on planets which are currently thought of as having "uninhabitable" gravities/atmospheres/whatever...

That one kept us going for a few minutes, for we (ie. the one guy who could be bothered to discuss such trivial and nonsensical matters) were thinking along similar lines.

2.
I then turned to my good old "What Are You Going To Do" ultimatum. We, as I see it, have three options.
  1. Work a 9-5 (or otherwise non-influential) job until retirement, do some gardening until you're on your deathbed, and realise that you haven't DONE anything in the last 80+ years.
  2. Actively take part in the r/evolution of the human species - become a scientist of some descript and hope that your work will aid the progression of our kind.
  3. Work a 9-5 job forever, telling yourself that "not everyone can make a difference", and that "even when we've moved to Mars/wherever, we'll still need garbologists".
What are YOU going to do?

3.
Colours.

Walking back to our holiday home-away-from-home, I saw a sign over the Bongaree Bowls Club. The sign was british racing green, with white-outlined, yellow lettering. There was a tall lightpost thingy casting semi-bright peach coloured light upon the greens. Here is my question.

How do we know that what I see as peach-coloured is seen as the same colour by you? We may look at the sign and both state that is is green with yellow lettering, but who is to say that my (or your) mind's eye does not see green as purple, or yellow as red? My eyes might register "red" 60 degrees further around a circular spectrum than yours. This might go some way to explaining why people "like" different colours. Who's to say that we don't all like the same colour as we see it in our mind? We might just call these colours different things. Does that make sense? I'm not sure how to explain it any better than that without a whiteboard and some coloured markers

Someone should shoot me for rambling so.
-rambletasticjaz

[EDIT]
Ammendment to Part 1:
Should not everyting we do be regarded as "natural", for we are ourselves part of "Nature"?
[/EDIT]

"My heart hates uggos." –J.D.
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Old 3rd January 2002, 04:34   #2
Xerxes
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1. Until environmentalism makes better business sense, nothing will be done as far as "cleaning" up the earth. There needs to be money to be made in cleaning- and as it stands its a money toilet. (And companies will only do it if the government tells them to)

2. I choose option (4) - I plan to take over the world

3. Now here is a subject I can talk about. I just finished an entire semester of a "Color Theory" College Class.

Simply put, we can assume that most people see color like other ******** why? Because

a. The phenomena of color is one sliver of light from the spectrum being reflected from a surface that absorbed the rest of it. Since eyes are virtually the same with little aberation, and we all recieve the same sliver of light being reflected to it (barring variables like shadow and light conditions), we all experience the same color for the most part.

b. Beyond that, we have a collective body of experience. There's the physical experience - we know what "red" looks like, as people know that stop signs are red, apples are red, blood is red. But then coupled with that is the shared psychological experience of society: Most of us associate pink with the feminine- if we all experienced pink differently (Some people seeing it as a cool color, or a very harsh color for example) then we all have different feelings about it.



With all that said, there is still some differences to how some see colors - and they can be tested with standardized spectrum tests. I was tested in the previously mentioned class with a 160 piece spectrum test - where you arrange 160 swatches into a perfectly flowing circular spectrum. Aberations in percieving color can be shown by which swatches you misplace. Color blind people will completely mess up one section (say the blues to violets) but do the rest OK. The average person will mess up 5 - 10 % of them. [smug] I, being an example of forward evolution in progress, missed none [/smug]

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Old 3rd January 2002, 04:35   #3
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about the colors thing, I think that humans all see the same colors because the colors have different frequencies. Our eyes act on those frequencies and display different colors. As far as I know, all our eyes are built the same, so they would interprate the colors the same.


My spelling in this post is probably horible. I have to reinstall office, so I currently don't have any spell check.

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Old 3rd January 2002, 04:36   #4
Xerxes
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Response to amendment:

If we are also considered part of the natural world, then my greed makes me the world's top environmentalist.

There's only one Xerxes- i'm an endangered species!
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Old 3rd January 2002, 05:29   #5
drake
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I have always found it odd to think that with no light there is no color. To realize that color is just really a trick that your eyes play on your mind. When I think that with no light around there is no color, I also think of that question of if no one is around to hear the tree fall does it make a sound question?

In my ignorant age I will attempt to say yes it does since it is just like a radio. If no one has their radio turned on but the station still broadcasts the signal. It is still in the air. So actually the two ideas about light and sound are unrelated in my mind.

Work in Progress

K-Jofol will never die as long as I don't lose or damage the backup!
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Old 3rd January 2002, 07:35   #6
Naamloos
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1 i think we are gonna change on that, as far as it is now we use it as the animals do

2 I've thought about that, but never got any answer or something, and I don't know how it is exactly

3 I'm still at school, I think i'll work 9-5 and discover that I haven't done anything special
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Old 3rd January 2002, 07:45   #7
Mr Jones
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Quote:
Originally posted by Xerxes


2. I choose option (4) - I plan to take over the world

Better hurry then, Sunday, September 28, 2036 isn't THAT far away X
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Old 3rd January 2002, 10:51   #8
Bilbo Baggins
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Personally, it is a sad time when we would rather make a few pounds than clean up the environment that after all nutures us.
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Old 3rd January 2002, 12:09   #9
ujay
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i) "You don't shit on your own doostep". Time we all took a broader view of this wise old saying.

ii)What you do for a living doesn't have to matter. It's what you do with your life that counts.

iii) British Racing Green eh, not seen that mentioned for many years.
This is about naming colours really, as long as we all agree on the names it doesn't matter what physical phenomenon they trigger in our perception.
What they trigger emotionally is a whole other ballgame, reds are exciting, blues are calming, all that Rudolf Steiner stuff. Ask any ad designer.
Where do we get these emotional associations from, how much are they learnt, how much are they innate ?
Take BRG for example, it's a rather dull sort of green, but still has a tremendous emotional attraction for me, takes me back to the days of Vanwalls and BRM and all the excitment of a big race. This is not lost on the promoters either, Jags have re-entered F1 and taken up BRG for their livery.

btw It's a beautiful sunny morning here, bit cold, but very seasonal for the time of year ...

UJ
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Old 3rd January 2002, 12:37   #10
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Can't you use that color theory on smells to ?
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Old 3rd January 2002, 14:52   #11
Xerxes
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Quote:
Originally posted by Mr Jones
Better hurry then, Sunday, September 28, 2036 isn't THAT far away X
Don't worry, It will be very quick conquest. By Sept 2036, I predict I will finish by epic conquest in Babylon, where I will die of Fever and be suceeded by my four trusted generals- Ptolemy, Seleucus, Lysimachus and Cassander
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Old 3rd January 2002, 17:55   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by ujay
i) "You don't shit on your own doostep". Time we all took a broader view of this wise old saying.
mind if I copywrite that?

Quote:
Originally posted by drake_2
I have always found it odd to think that with no light there is no color. To realize that color is just really a trick that your eyes play on your mind. When I think that with no light around there is no color, I also think of that question of if no one is around to hear the tree fall does it make a sound question?

In my ignorant age I will attempt to say yes it does since it is just like a radio. If no one has their radio turned on but the station still broadcasts the signal. It is still in the air. So actually the two ideas about light and sound are unrelated in my mind.
I'll be thinking about this later.
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Old 3rd January 2002, 22:15   #13
Bilbo Baggins
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I think that Xerxes has a greater chance of waking up than taking over the world
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Old 3rd January 2002, 22:19   #14
Xerxes
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I wouldn't be saying things like that if I was a future subject of my global empire...

"Remember that I can do anything to anybody"
-Caligula
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Old 4th January 2002, 00:47   #15
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Quote:
Originally posted by Xerxes
...be suceeded by my four trusted generals- Ptolemy, Seleucus, Lysimachus and Cassander...
I think it's time you promoted me, Xerxes.
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Old 4th January 2002, 07:00   #16
Xerxes
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Sgt. Fuzzbubblis
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