2 Years Today With No Update For Winamp!

[musicf8]

Curious, why are you running about 2-3 instances per PC?

[Alphasee]

I think, realistically, it needs a new name/brand. It's just been too long, and no matter what happens, it's been long enough those that have kept their hopes up will simply complain or contrast what is and isn't there.

Those that aren't familiar with it, will have had no previous experience with it, will want something that's different than what's out there.

I do like that it's returning a bit more to its roots, but the heavy windows API reliance concerns me for the simple fact people use apps that are OS nonspecific. I miss it, I really do, but I'm hoping that it's fresh enough, new enough, dope enough, I'm not afraid to load my media into it anymore.

[talon1212]

If its heavily windows API reliant, how did they make the recent Winamp for OSX?
Is the OSX app even any good, it looks way different.

[Tergulath]

In hindsight wouldn't it have been better if WINAMP was open source? I feel the community would have provided a build by now if it was open source.

[nicolai123az]

I agree. I don't see much update

[j7n]

Originally Posted by Alphasee

I think, realistically, it needs a new name/brand. It's just been too long, and no matter what happens, it's been long enough those that have kept their hopes up will simply complain or contrast what is and isn't there.

I do like that it's returning a bit more to its roots, but the heavy windows API reliance concerns me for the simple fact people use apps that are OS nonspecific.

OS-nonspecific applications tend to be slow and clunky, and/or with reduced functionality. I hate how modern software is often web-based when it comes to the user interface. Software built around "QT" has okay-ish performance, but the install size and memory use is larger than necessary, and the UI widgets don't feel quite right. I only use such software when there is no good Windows-native alternative. I do use SMPlayer and VLC, but that's about it. I have recently wiped the last piece of "GTK" software and the runtime off my system with a relief.

With a new name, the new developers would surely surely feel free to make a dumbed down product, with all the downsides of modern software: flat™ design, slow performance, overall "webbiness" feel. Most functions currently in the core would be left for plugin developers to implement. And the sum of all the respective plugins would be several times the size of the entire player as it is now. Firefox and Chromium are like that, compared to old Opera, for example.

Mac and cellphone users can select another media player. There must be numerous alternatives.

I don't know how REAPER feels on Mac computers, and whether it is as efficient and complete. The Windows version does feel complete native. Its size is also reasonable. That is a good example of dual platform sofware, that doesn't rely on "web" components.

[ZooperDooper]

Hi, I have been using Winamp since it was v1.61. But, for the last 10 years I have used nothing but VLC player for anything video and winamp just for audio.

I have spent over 15K on my sound system and only use winamp. I have recently moved to Win 10 and have noticed that I can't make Winamp the default audio player. I am also having trouble with file association (win10 fault) so choosing just enqueue in winamp is buggy as hell.
Here is my list of "Minimum Must Haves" for a V6 winamp. Which I would be happy to pay $10 - $20 for. Even though I understand you want it to be freeware with video???

Must be able to run the skin - Pimeer_Modern_v2 (the only skin I liked and use)
"Enqueue in winamp" context menu's.
Visualizer with Milkdrop
The EQ, Playlist editor, media library as it stands with shoutcast, bookmarks, and everything else.
Rip to flac/mp3
Metadata reading/album cover
24 bit sound
Global hotkeys
7.1 output would be nice.

Plugins that I use and I would be lost without
Steamripper
Minilyrics (was a great plugin, but believe their server is now turned off)
Resumer
Audioburst (paid for)

I understand that everyone has their own custom setup, but this has been mine for over 10 years and has served me perfectly. The win10 default/enqueue bugs is what is annoying me most atm.

GL and I hope V6 could at minimum do all the above?
btw, those saying Winamp should change its name obviously don't understand anything about loyalty branding which Winamp has. Its a very stupid idea imo.

[talon1212]

DJ eggs, can you make it so, that when winamp is docked at the bottom of the screen,
that its invisible instead of seeing a 1 pixel line, thats not there when docked to the top of the screen.

[wxrance]

Originally Posted by Tergulath

In hindsight wouldn't it have been better if WINAMP was open source? I feel the community would have provided a build by now if it was open source.

I agree with this. Not to be insulting to Egg and the guys but two freaking years and nothing is still a long time sorry to say. At this point it will have to be amazing when it does come out. And it would be good if you kept the board updated with what your doing. Not that post that pages deep either.

[musicf8]

Originally Posted by TheWalruss

I don't think you can make commercial product open source.

you can, at least on the code that's owned by the company. They just essentially license that portion to an open source license.

[womble dung]

Originally Posted by DJ Egg

I'm pretty sure I already explained everything via the links in the first post of the News thread...

We could release a public 5.8 beta right now....
Though there would be no CD Burning, no Gracenote (cddb, autotag, playlist generator, etc) replacement, and no Queuing features
(Q / Alt+click, enhanced J dialog, and all other features provided by JTFE).

We could probably get away with one or two of those things, but I'm not sure about all three.
Sure, there's currently no working Gracenote features in 5.666 either....
But what I don't want is another Winamp3 type situation with tons of "where's this? where's that? you suck!" type of complaints.

This is what HAS been done so far:

1. Replaced Fraunhofer MP3 Decoder with a top quality open source decoder (details to come later).

2. Replaced Fraunhofer AAC decoder with native Windows decoder (Media Foundation)

3. Replaced H.264 & MPEG-4 Part-2 video decoders with native Windows decoders
(we were looking at using OpenH264 but it has limitations and doesn't currently support High Profile)

4. Replaced Sonic CD playback & ripping engine with native Windows API

5. Removed DRM support from Windows Media Decoder (WMA/WMV/ASF)

6. Removed MP3 and HE-AAC encoders from the installer (these will now need to be downloaded separately)
Note: We were planning on also writing a new AAC-LC-only encoder based off Media Foundation...

7. A plethora of new features, bug fixes, updates & optimizations.... and there are many many of these !!!

1-6 makes Winamp legal, and also means that we don't have to pay anyone for licenses/patents/etc (like AOL were doing previously), and we can release it as 100% freeware again (i.e. no more Pro version - the free version will be fully functional)

Note that the Media Foundation decoders are Windows Vista and higher, so there'll be no native support for those formats on WinXP (though it will still install on XP sp3, and relevant plugins/decoders from 5.666 will still work)

So.... current team....as I explained in the News thread.....

From Jan 2014 to Sep 2014 it was just DrO and me.
From Sep 2014-Aug 2015 = nobody. We had to work on SHOUTcast 2.4.x+ instead.
No working SHOUTcast monetization meant no revenue meant no Winamp.
From ~Sep 2015 onwards... no more DrO :-(
DrO removed his JTFE plugin from the code base and distribution.
The team is now made up of me, plus a few other former Winamp coders who already have another full-time job.
We are doing the best we can, the others are doing it in whatever spare time they can find.

As also previously explained, DrO committed a lot of code between Jan-Sep 2014, most of which was awesome, but some of it was unfinished and made v5.8 unstable when switching skins and when dealing with metadata, amongst other issues. So we decided to roll everything back to ~Feb 2014 and started recommitting / cherry-picking code.
We're now almost back to where we were before. There's now no crashes like before, and we have a pretty stable build.... except, unlike how there has been for the past ~13 years, there's now no Queue / JTFE features :-(

Of course, we could've all just stepped aside and let Radionomy take over with new devs who weren't familiar with any of the Winamp code (unlike the rest of us who've got between ~8-16 years experience), and maybe there'd be a new Winamp version out by now. Would it look and be anything at all like the current Winamp that we all know and love, with all the same great features? Who knows? Though my guess would be 'probably not'.

But let's also not forget that without Radionomy, we would not be here right now. So praises be to them!

I'm very sorry that it's taking so long. We're doing the best we can... and we're getting there... slowly but surely.

Thank you for your patience and understanding.

i understand completely.
having used winamp since the early 2000's i find it the most instinctive media player there is, and get disappointed with almost all of the others around.

so i am more than happy to wait till the devs are ready to roll.


one critisism though; I WISH THERE WAS A LINUX/UBUNTU VERSION as i love using those platforms, but find their media players either nerdy or gimmicky

[DJ-Garybaldy]

one critisism though; I WISH THERE WAS A LINUX/UBUNTU VERSION as i love using those platforms, but find their media players either nerdy or gimmicky

I have the latest Winamp working OK under .wine on Ubuntu studio.

[Gamergeek1981]

Dear DJ Egg:

I've been a supporter of winamp since 2005 when I purchased the pro version but it's been a while since winamp changed hands and still no word. I hope we can hear something soon.

[JasonFriday13]

Originally Posted by womble dung

one critisism though; I WISH THERE WAS A LINUX/UBUNTU VERSION as i love using those platforms, but find their media players either nerdy or gimmicky

I've used RhythmBox in the past quite a bit, this fills my needs quite nicely so I haven't looked at any others.

Regarding DJ Egg's update post, I absolutely agree. My priority list would be basic queue functionality, album art and album metadata (FreeDB in EAC works quite well), then CD burning last. I don't remember the last time I burned a CD, most of the time I'm using EAC to turn a CD into an image file for storage, and I use that mounted in a virtual drive to read from it.

Despite being a 10+ year veteran on the forums (mostly spent in the NSIS sub-forum) I've only recently (2013) started using Winamp as my main player. I thought I would give it a go and have never looked back. I've never really been a fan of skins, so I'm just using the default blue and silver W5 skin. Using Winamp is the main reason I moved from MP3 files to Vorbis, because Ubuntu and my Android phone both support Vorbis. In the future I plan to move my collection to Opus once it is widely supported (my collection isn't very big, about 24 artists and roughly a 1000 songs).

[Aminifu]

Originally Posted by JasonFriday13

... In the future I plan to move my collection to Opus once it is widely supported (my collection isn't very big, about 24 artists and roughly a 1000 songs).

Have you seen this thread (http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?t=347029)?

[JasonFriday13]

Yeah I have seen thinktink's plugin, nice piece of work that is. I was originally going to skip Vorbis and go straight to Opus, but my phone at the time didn't support Opus. I'm not that worried about Opus support in Winamp because Vorbis still fills my needs (open-source and good quality-to-filesize ratio). Really, Opus is just for smaller files at the same quality level (in my case that's: Opus at 128kbps, Vorbis at 160kbps, and MP3 at 192kbps). Even the shift from MP3 to Vorbis reduced the file sizes by about a quarter (from 6MB to 4.5MB on average).

[Aminifu]

Originally Posted by JasonFriday13

... Really, Opus is just for smaller files at the same quality level (in my case that's: Opus at 128kbps, Vorbis at 160kbps, and MP3 at 192kbps). Even the shift from MP3 to Vorbis reduced the file sizes by about a quarter (from 6MB to 4.5MB on average).

Are you converting directly from mp3 to vorbis? I was under the impression that converting from 1 lossy format to another lossy format further degrades the quality of the file.

I had been waiting for the lossless wavpack format to be better supported, so that I could re-rip my music that is currently in mp3 format. Wavpack is very similar to flac, but it uses the id3 tagging standard. I rather have fewer high quality songs, than more lower quality songs on my mobile device.

Now, I'm thinking about investing in the Pioneer XDP-100R (http://www.techhive.com/article/3050...s-supreme.html). It's expensive, but I don't want to further strain my eyes looking at a tiny screen (which is why I don't have a smartphone).

[JasonFriday13]

Originally Posted by Aminifu

Are you converting directly from mp3 to vorbis? I was under the impression that converting from 1 lossy format to another lossy format further degrades the quality of the file.

It does. Every time a lossy file is converted back to a bitstream, it's not an exact copy of the bitstream that created the file. So if you convert the file enough times, it will degrade down to just noise. I learned about this quite a long time ago.

I still own nearly every cd of the music that I regularly listen to, and for each shift in format I'm reading from the cd to create the lossy file. Eventually I'll transfer these cd's into digital mirror images for storage but I just don't have the space for them yet (I have a FreeNAS server with no harddrives, when money allows I'll buy a set of 12 drives and put it to use).

I'm not really an audiophile, so as long as I can't tell the difference between the original lossless format and the lossy format, happy days. The bitrates I stated earlier are roughly the rates required for transparency. On Opus I can tell the difference between a 112kbps and a 128kbps file. The 112kbps file has the high frequencies starting to run into each other, where the 128kbps file is basically transparent. I don't have any expensive headphones or audio equipment, for me the music is to fill in the gap while I do other tasks (mainly programming). I listen to post-2000 rock and metal music mostly, but I do have a collection of 80's pop/rock music that I occasionally listen to.

[Aminifu]

Originally Posted by JasonFriday13

I'm not really an audiophile, so as long as I can't tell the difference between the original lossless format and the lossy format, happy days.

I understand. I can't afford to be a 'true' audiophile.

I'm over 60, but when it comes to music I still feel like the teenager I was at Woodstock. I enjoy several genres and my music collection covers several decades. Minus the artifacts introduced by turntables and tape players, some of the common lossless digital formats come very close to the 'full-bodied' sound of the old analog era. Some of the new digital formats being introduced are removing that difference.

This is why I like Winamp so much. It and the careful use of certain 3rd party plug-ins (which took me a long time to find and learn how to use) lets me hear every nuance captured in my files that my mid-range soundcard and speaker system or multichannel headphones are able to reproduce (while removing or reducing undesirable artifacts). Sometimes it is like I'm sitting in at a studio performance!

[M3wThr33]

I get scared when I see feature requests. Feature creep can really kill a project, and for something that's currently struggling to just get out the door, you could spend an eternity adding little requests.

[Nissehamp]

Originally Posted by talon1212

If its heavily windows API reliant, how did they make the recent Winamp for OSX?
Is the OSX app even any good, it looks way different.

I tried the OSX-version, because i've loved, and used, Winamp since Win98, and still do, but the OSX-version is next to useless for me. There is not even a media library(!). I don't think i've uninstalled a mediaplayer that fast since RealPlayer! Nightingale is the closest i've come to a proper media player for OSX, but it's still not Winamp :/ Lucky that i got myself a new windows laptop, so the Mac doesn't have to be my primary laptop anymore

[yayou]

What a wonderful thing! Winamp will come back. Men, you've made my day. Just keep on working as fast and as well as you can, we will wait. Thank you men, for what you're doing. May Heaven inspire you.

[bluejay99]

Thank you for the update, I'll wait as long as it takes. I'd rather have it "good" than "Thursday".

[ryckman]

I just want to say a BIG THANKS for your continued hard work and commitment in keeping this iconic media player alive and loyal to the original.

Looking forward for the next release!

[Sabine Klare]

My Winamps on my PC and on my notebook have reached the 1.95 GB now, with nearly 4000 textures (more than the mentioned 2500 textures in one of my previous posts). In the following days I want to upload at least those additional random textures in .zip-folders on Mediafire, which are 100% from me.

I think, that also the current Winamp Version and the Milkdrop Visualizer work fine on Windows 8 and Windows 10, although I myself have no one of these newer Windows Versions.

And I believe, that a new Winamp version will come out some day, no matter, when it will happen. We will look forward...

[anserq]

Waiting for the next release, I love winamp

[peppert]

wat

[synthetiq]

Yeah back to the good ol' days of beta testing I Wanna try the new toy!

[doomedromance]

I really only want a media library and to play music. Don't use any of the other stuff, but nothing good is like this so i settle for winamp.
I would gladly use a winamp without cd burning, gracenoe, and shoutcast, web browser, podcasts, online services. I use none of that stuff.

Originally Posted by DJ Egg

I'm pretty sure I already explained everything via the links in the first post of the News thread...

We could release a public 5.8 beta right now....
Though there would be no CD Burning, no Gracenote (cddb, autotag, playlist generator, etc) replacement, and no Queuing features
(Q / Alt+click, enhanced J dialog, and all other features provided by JTFE).

We could probably get away with one or two of those things, but I'm not sure about all three.
Sure, there's currently no working Gracenote features in 5.666 either....
But what I don't want is another Winamp3 type situation with tons of "where's this? where's that? you suck!" type of complaints.

This is what HAS been done so far:

1. Replaced Fraunhofer MP3 Decoder with a top quality open source decoder (details to come later).

2. Replaced Fraunhofer AAC decoder with native Windows decoder (Media Foundation)

3. Replaced H.264 & MPEG-4 Part-2 video decoders with native Windows decoders
(we were looking at using OpenH264 but it has limitations and doesn't currently support High Profile)

4. Replaced Sonic CD playback & ripping engine with native Windows API

5. Removed DRM support from Windows Media Decoder (WMA/WMV/ASF)

6. Removed MP3 and HE-AAC encoders from the installer (these will now need to be downloaded separately)
Note: We were planning on also writing a new AAC-LC-only encoder based off Media Foundation...

7. A plethora of new features, bug fixes, updates & optimizations.... and there are many many of these !!!

1-6 makes Winamp legal, and also means that we don't have to pay anyone for licenses/patents/etc (like AOL were doing previously), and we can release it as 100% freeware again (i.e. no more Pro version - the free version will be fully functional)

Note that the Media Foundation decoders are Windows Vista and higher, so there'll be no native support for those formats on WinXP (though it will still install on XP sp3, and relevant plugins/decoders from 5.666 will still work)

So.... current team....as I explained in the News thread.....

From Jan 2014 to Sep 2014 it was just DrO and me.
From Sep 2014-Aug 2015 = nobody. We had to work on SHOUTcast 2.4.x+ instead.
No working SHOUTcast monetization meant no revenue meant no Winamp.
From ~Sep 2015 onwards... no more DrO :-(
DrO removed his JTFE plugin from the code base and distribution.
The team is now made up of me, plus a few other former Winamp coders who already have another full-time job.
We are doing the best we can, the others are doing it in whatever spare time they can find.

As also previously explained, DrO committed a lot of code between Jan-Sep 2014, most of which was awesome, but some of it was unfinished and made v5.8 unstable when switching skins and when dealing with metadata, amongst other issues. So we decided to roll everything back to ~Feb 2014 and started recommitting / cherry-picking code.
We're now almost back to where we were before. There's now no crashes like before, and we have a pretty stable build.... except, unlike how there has been for the past ~13 years, there's now no Queue / JTFE features :-(

Of course, we could've all just stepped aside and let Radionomy take over with new devs who weren't familiar with any of the Winamp code (unlike the rest of us who've got between ~8-16 years experience), and maybe there'd be a new Winamp version out by now. Would it look and be anything at all like the current Winamp that we all know and love, with all the same great features? Who knows? Though my guess would be 'probably not'.

But let's also not forget that without Radionomy, we would not be here right now. So praises be to them!

I'm very sorry that it's taking so long. We're doing the best we can... and we're getting there... slowly but surely.

Thank you for your patience and understanding.

[makaiguy]

Originally Posted by doomedromance

I would gladly use a winamp without cd burning, gracenoe, and shoutcast, web browser, podcasts, online services. I use none of that stuff.

^^^^ What doomedromance said.

[ampshout]

+1 what makaiguy said

[musicf8]

^ What ampshout said

CD Burning/Ripping - there's better programs (e.g. EAC) that handle ripping more accurately, and burning makes more sense in a program that can burn more than just audio cds imo.
Gracenote - Tried it a few times, think it accurately ID'd one song once, might be because most of my stuff is underground/older electronic music.
Shoutcast - Used it back in the day for Bluemars & Digitally Imported. Bluemars is gone, and di.fm requires a monthly fee to use winamp now, so don't need it.
Web Browser - god I hated this when it was implemented, most annoying thing ever put into winamp. Not to mention it just opens security holes because it uses trident.
Podcasts - never got into it
Online Services - Again, fun to play with it when it first came out, but now there's nothing really relevant on there, especially with all these other services you can access via the browser.

The only other thing I would love is make videos an add-on package instead of being a part of the default package.

[Avantika Thakur]

yes that true . There is no update from the past 2 years till now and i am wait it for new version. All software doing update there version and you should also update your version also.

[Luin]

What would it take, how many pleadings do you need to launch a beta version like you have it now, without the extra s*cheet most people don't use anyway.

Please make a poll if you think people would rather wait for the kind of stuff
In my opinion, we would be much better served by android and ios apps with novel implementations such as support for cross-feed dsp for example.

Or at least say something, for crying out loud, all this wait and no feed-back..
If it's bad, give us the bad news, just don't keep us waiting like this.. FOR YEARS, it's becoming really really annoying and all the love we had for winamp could not make up for all this nothing.

Here's another ideea, make a special group for beta testers, for people like us that would rather have it like it's now than wait another minute. WE WILL HELP!

[musicf8]

You can try to contact radionomy directly. Pleading and complaining on the forums doesn't do anything, as it shows for the past couple years.

[ampshout]

Taking into account everything that's been said and done, DJ Egg's last post on this in March of this year. Is Winamp officially abandonware? a simple yes or no would suffice, otherwise every couple of days/weeks/months I get my hopes up for nothing when I check.

Yes I know there are other products out there, I don't want to use them. I know there's a skeleton crew working on this, doesn't mean they can't provide at least one line updates from time to time.

I know you will say just be patient but a man can only be so patient before he moves on with his life. Basically, I'm going to need to break up with you Winamp, if you don't get your sh*t in order pretty soon.

extra disclaimer* to any joe shmoe repliers: I know Winamp works perfectly but so does a nokia 3210 as long as you don't need it to do anything smartphone like... if you get my meaning :P

[musicf8]

So you don't want to use other products, but at the same time you are talking about dropping winamp? Seriously though, as my prior comment stated, pleading and complaining doesn't do anything on the forums. We are all on the same boat, so no point beating a dead horse. Winamp basically is not dead, but not alive either... more like purgatory. Once something is ready im sure it will be released, though given there be any remaining interest from users is questionable.

[jaishreerawat]

Which is the latest version right now ?

[DJ-Garybaldy]

Originally Posted by jaishreerawat

Which is the latest version right now ?

5.666

[musicf8]

http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?t=373755

it's stickied at the top...