Old 7th August 2008, 21:38   #1
sankt
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Bitorrent Streaming Is Alive And Kicking

The wonderful folks at the European P2P streaming consortium have a test stream up and running. trial.p2p-next.org

The group has a Windows and Linux client available, free to download.

This Open Source Technology uses VLC as the base for watching the stream, soooo imagine what could be done with NSV + H.264 + swarmplayer The possibilities are fantastic !

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Old 7th August 2008, 21:46   #2
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cheers sankt and if anymore spam new or old appears
let me know.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 7th August 2008, 23:15   #3
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Hm... It's looking good so far, should be fun to see how it will work out
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Old 7th August 2008, 23:24   #4
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I managed to track down how to set up your own Bittorrent Stream : www.tribler.org/StreamingExperiment

Both live video and video on demand is supported.

You would need to download the Tribler client for actual streaming. ( Tribler is both open source and free to download. )

The streaming guide example uses the Linux operating system. The encoding software is FFmpeg. FFmpeg natively supports both the H.264 video and AAC+ audio codecs.

Using H.264 and AAC+ would maximize the use of bandwidth and provide a excellent audio / video broadcast for Bittorrent streaming.

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Old 8th August 2008, 00:52   #5
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that's amazing for live streaming. So high bitrate streams at no bandwidth costs for a dedicated server?
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Old 8th August 2008, 01:38   #6
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Yep, with Bittorrent streaming - there is no need for dedicated servers or massive amounts of bandwidth. True Peer to Peer streaming, without the headache of downloading a bunch of software and relying on ActiveX or Java to make the darn thing work.

Bittorrent distribution is a very mature technology, thats the great part of the equation. They just have to work out the minor kinks with Tribler and the SwarmPlayer now. Bittorrent is also well recognized by both computer experts and beginners.

The only missing element is a " station directory ", but I could easily see Pirate Bay adding a section for that.

The FCC recently slapped down the American national cable Internet provider Comcast over " Traffic Shaping ", so Bittorrent poisoning or throttling should quickly diminish in the USA. Attempts to squash legitimate Bittorrent use in the EU should also slow down, since the EU Telecom industry is funding and pushing for the advancement of this technology.

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Old 8th August 2008, 02:32   #7
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Now ISPS just need to stop limiting people's bandwidth. More and more isps are starting to do this.

Yeah I also see this leading to streaming of copyrighted content. I don't see a way (yet) that'll tell you exactly who you are connected to. So people will assume it's safe and more and more will switch over to this p2p streaming.
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Old 8th August 2008, 20:56   #8
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Here is some additional information for streaming : www.tribler.org/LiveStreamingBeta

The most important thing that Bittorrent Streaming has is the ability to draw stream information from multiple sources, so that if one source fails - the client draws information from other sources. Point to point node failure is what kills most P2P streaming projects. Bittorrent Streaming eliminates that !

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Old 8th August 2008, 21:27   #9
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err from when ffmpeg supports AAC+ encoding?..
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Old 8th August 2008, 22:41   #10
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Standard AAC - not AAC+ (HE-AAC), I stand corrected.

Installing ffmpeg with AAC support
drupal.org/node/131600

Year of AAC in FFmpeg
codecs.multimedia.cx/?p=132

How to convert MP3 to AAC using FFmpeg
http://www.howforge.com/how-to-conve...c-using-ffmpeg

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Old 9th August 2008, 12:09   #11
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I tried streaming with it.
It's good but now it only supports MPEG TS mux so VLC streaming and no NSV.

I opened a ticket to know if it's possible to fix that NSV issue.
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Old 9th August 2008, 13:43   #12
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You maybe able to pipe the output of a local shoutcast DNAS stream to vlc then convert it to a compliant Transport Stream format.

Creating Transport Streams with VLC - wiki.videolan.org/MPEG-TS

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Old 9th August 2008, 14:00   #13
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Quote:
Originally posted by sankt
You maybe able to pipe the output of a local shoutcast DNAS stream to vlc then convert it to a compliant Transport Stream format.

Creating Transport Streams with VLC - wiki.videolan.org/MPEG-TS
I tried that too, but VLC crashes when trying to convert NSV
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Old 9th August 2008, 14:25   #14
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What about demuxing the NSV stream ( stripping away the NSV container format ) so that all you have is the audio / video ?

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Old 9th August 2008, 14:38   #15
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TsRemux v0.21.2: Transport Stream De/Re-muxer
( Open Source )
forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=125447

Transport Stream muxer (tsMuxeR) can mux pretty much anything into a regular transport stream and now even Blu-ray's M2TS
( Free )
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Multime.../tsMuxeR.shtml

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Old 9th August 2008, 20:43   #16
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Quote:
Originally posted by sankt
TsRemux v0.21.2: Transport Stream De/Re-muxer
( Open Source )
forum.doom9.org/showthread.php?t=125447

Transport Stream muxer (tsMuxeR) can mux pretty much anything into a regular transport stream and now even Blu-ray's M2TS
( Free )
http://www.softpedia.com/get/Multime.../tsMuxeR.shtml
I'll try, but it's not possible a thing like that when streaming live content

EDIT:

Okay I demuxed NSV with NSVD and muxed it with TSMuxer.
I think it should work now
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Old 10th August 2008, 00:40   #17
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How about posting the tstream file

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Old 10th August 2008, 08:54   #18
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Quote:
Originally posted by sankt
How about posting the tstream file
Yeah, but first I want to find a solution for the live streaming
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Old 10th August 2008, 18:41   #19
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FFMPEG can be used to demux NSV
The file name can be `-' to read from standard input or to write to standard output.
ffmpeg.mplayerhq.hu/ffmpeg-doc.html#SEC17

tsMuxer supports both the H.264 and AAC codecs.
tsMuxer has a console version available for Linux as well.
www.smlabs.net/tsmuxer_en.html

Pipe output of NSV stream from Shoutcast DNAS to FFMPEG
Pipe demuxed output from FFMPEG to tsMuxer
Pipe converted TS data to creatlivestream.py

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Old 10th August 2008, 19:15   #20
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Quote:
Originally posted by sankt
FFMPEG can be used to demux NSV
The file name can be `-' to read from standard input or to write to standard output.
ffmpeg.mplayerhq.hu/ffmpeg-doc.html#SEC17

tsMuxer supports both the H.264 and AAC codecs.
tsMuxer has a console version available for Linux as well.
www.smlabs.net/tsmuxer_en.html

Pipe output of NSV stream from Shoutcast DNAS to FFMPEG
Pipe demuxed output from FFMPEG to tsMuxer
Pipe converted TS data to creatlivestream.py
Thanks mate for this info, I will do some tests tomorrow
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Old 16th August 2008, 16:05   #21
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Using FFMPEG to demux a NSV stream and convert it into a MPEG Transport Stream.
( To use with the Tribler software. )

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- I "stream name . format extension" - ( input NSV stream name )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- F RAW VIDEO ( demux NSV file into raw audio / video )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- VCODEC "video codec" ( encode raw video using specified codec )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- S "resolution" ( specified video resolution )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- B "bitrate" ( specified video bitrate )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- BT "bitrate" ( specified bitrate resolution )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- ACODEC "audio codec" ( encode raw audio using specified codec )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- AR "frequency" ( specified audio frequency )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- AB "bitrate" ( specified audio bitrate )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- AC "channel" ( specified number of audio channels )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
- F MPEGTS ( convert data to transport stream format )
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Areas in Red need to be changed according to your stream requirements.

I will host TS stream files for Bittorrent NSV streams.
Your stream must be 24 / 7 and must not be adult or copyrighted material.

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Old 16th August 2008, 19:35   #22
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Thanks for that sankt..
im going to give this a try i think.

So Long, and Thanks for All the Fish.
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Old 16th August 2008, 20:59   #23
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I will put together a page to help people setting up a bittorrent NSV stream.

There are two ways you can create a bittorrent nsv stream - using mencoder and ffmpeg or just ffmpeg. Using just ffmpeg should eliminate the need to have several data pipes operating.

As usual, any feed back - comments or corrections are greatly appreciated.

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Old 28th August 2008, 07:39   #24
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Bittorrent distribution is a very mature technology, thats the great part of the equation. They just have to work out the minor kinks with Tribler and the SwarmPlayer now. Bittorrent is also well recognized by both computer experts and beginners.
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Old 28th August 2008, 21:57   #25
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Very well said.

You would have to be living under a rock not to know what Bittorrent is.

I also love the fact that they are basing the technology on Open Source software.

The continued financial support of the project will ensure that it will keep improving and growing.

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Old 29th August 2008, 00:38   #26
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Quote:
Originally posted by sankt
As usual, any feed back - comments or corrections are greatly appreciated.
Couple of things about your ffmpeg hints:

1) ffmpeg is case sensitive, all your examples show -I -B -ACODEC etc, wont work

2) not sure about what -I "stream name.format extenstion" means ... ffmpeg can directly read from a shoutcast server, e.g. -i http://localhost:8000/ - note, no ;stream.nsv, no listen.pls etc

3) to get the raw video format, its -f rawvideo ... note, no space between raw and video
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Old 31st August 2008, 06:03   #27
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The following command can convert a standard HTTP MP3 shoutcast stream into a TS compliant stream.

The following command works great, but it's using HTTP:
C:\Program Files\VideoLAN\VLC>vlc http : // shoutcastserverIP : port --sout http / ts : 192.168.X.X : 1235

However - when tried with a NSV stream, it just picks up the audio, and leaves the video out.

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Old 1st September 2008, 02:59   #28
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Is there a normal way to stream via bittorrent w/out nsv?
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Old 1st September 2008, 14:30   #29
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You can use VLC to encode the audio / video content and encapsulate the stream using the Transport Stream format.

www.scvi.net/stream/bitstream.htm

However, it still would be nice to be able to pull NSV video from Shoutcast / Icecast servers and stream it using Bittorrent Streaming.

Shoutcast streaming audio works great with Bittorrent Streaming.

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Old 7th September 2008, 09:44   #30
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I've good news (quite good).
I've managed to stream NSV with SwarmPlayer.
Later I'll provide all infos.
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Old 7th September 2008, 13:15   #31
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Three Cheers !

Details will be greatly appreciated.

Bandwidth problems are no more

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Old 7th September 2008, 13:35   #32
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well, the h264 problem is not solved, infact I managed to stream NSV with SP encoding it with XVID codec.
I built the xvid coder plugin and then I used the SCVI tutorial that uses vlc to encapsulate the stream into MPEGTS muxer.

The quality is not as good as h264 but it's something.
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Old 7th September 2008, 22:12   #33
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This might be the time to add the Dirac video codec to the list of NSV supported encoder plugins - www.diracvideo.org

The latest version of VLC natively supports the Dirac video codec. forum.videolan.org/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=44673

The format identifier for encapsulating Dirac video within MPEG2 Transport Streams has been registered with the SMPTE. ( Society of Motion Picture and Television Engineers. )

The Dirac test video files encoded by the BBC are encapsulated in the Transport Stream format.
dirac.kw.bbc.co.uk/download/video/maybefinal/

Dirac provides video quality and compression that are comparable to H.264.

Dirac is Open Source as well.

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Old 7th September 2008, 22:32   #34
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how did i know Dirac was going to appear in this thread ?

Still dirac is worth a try through.

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Old 7th September 2008, 22:53   #35
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I really want to see this take off Jkey

I will dig up every little scrap of information I can - to keep this moving forward.

Bittorrent Streaming would be the key to make NSV stand out again !

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Old 8th September 2008, 08:20   #36
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I've also looked at Dirac but I didn't find anything useful.
Does even exist a vfw version of this codec?
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Old 8th September 2008, 11:01   #37
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Dirac ffmpeg patches
http://diracvideo.org/download/dirac...fmpeg-patches/


Did you try streaming with VP6 ? I know its nothing like H.264 - but its much better than VP3 and slightly better than Xvid / Divx.

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Old 8th September 2008, 11:34   #38
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Quote:
Originally posted by sankt
Dirac ffmpeg patches
http://diracvideo.org/download/dirac...fmpeg-patches/


Did you try streaming with VP6 ? I know its nothing like H.264 - but its much better than VP3 and slightly better than Xvid / Divx.
Yes but same problem when encapsulating with VLC (getting only audio).
The error is:
code:
[00000303] nsv demuxer error: invalid signature 0xef5e7253 (Sr^?) [00000298] main private error: cannot add this stream [00000330] main packetizer error: cannot create packetizer output (VP61)



About the dirac, how can I build an encode plugin if I haven't a VFW Config Gui?
How to use ffmpeg with NSVCAP?
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Old 8th September 2008, 13:59   #39
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Mencoder

Use mencoder to wrap a existing stream using Transport Stream format.

$ mencoder -ovc copy -oac copy -o news.nsv news.ts

copies video / audio of news.nsv into news.ts format

http://www.togaware.com/linux/surviv...Transport.html

This was originally referenced for a mpeg stream.

Cant hurt to try nsv, since mencoder / mplayer does support NSV.

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Old 8th September 2008, 14:59   #40
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Using that, I'm getting an AVI file
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