Old 11th May 2004, 20:01   #1
dlinkwit27
has no CT
(Forum King)
 
dlinkwit27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 13,235
Send a message via ICQ to dlinkwit27 Send a message via AIM to dlinkwit27 Send a message via Yahoo to dlinkwit27
American Beheaded

American beheaded 'for abuse'
Cairo - A video posted on Tuesday on an Islamic militant website showed a group affiliated with al-Qaeda beheading an American contractor in Iraq, saying the death was revenge for the abuse of Iraqi prisoners by American soldiers.

Fox News has reported that the video showed five men wearing headscarves and black ski masks, standing over a bound man in an orange jumpsuit - similar to a prisoner's uniform - who identified himself as Nick Berg, a contractor from West Chester, Philadelphia, whose body was found on a highway overpass in Baghdad on Saturday.

"My name is Nick Berg, my father's name is Michael, my mother's name is Susan," the man said on the video. "I have a brother and sister, David and Sarah. I live in Philadelphia."

After reading a statement, the men were seen pulling the man to his side and putting a large knife to his neck. A scream sounded as the men cut his head off, shouting "Allahu Akbar!" - "God is great." They then held the head out before the camera.

"For the mothers and wives of American soldiers, we tell you that we offered the US administration to exchange this hostage with some of the detainees in Abu Ghraib and they refused," one of the men read from a statement.

"So we tell you that the dignity of the Muslim men and women in Abu Ghraib and others is not redeemed except by blood and souls. You will not receive anything from us but coffins after coffins, slaughtered in this way".

The video bore the title "Abu Musab al-Zarqawi shown slaughtering an American."

It was unclear whether al-Zarqawi - a lieutenant of Osama bin Laden - was shown in the video, or was claiming responsibility for ordering the execution.

The website on which the video was posted is known as a clearing house for al-Qaeda and Islamic extremist groups' statements and tapes.

http://www.news24.com/News24/World/I...525439,00.html
dlinkwit27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 20:04   #2
dlinkwit27
has no CT
(Forum King)
 
dlinkwit27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 13,235
Send a message via ICQ to dlinkwit27 Send a message via AIM to dlinkwit27 Send a message via Yahoo to dlinkwit27
[/Video Shows Beheading of American in Iraq

LOUIS MEIXLER, Associated Press Writer

BAGHDAD, Iraq - A video posted Tuesday on an al-Qaida-linked Web site showed the beheading an American civilian in Iraq (news - web sites) in what was said to be revenge for abuse of Iraqi prisoners.


The video showed five men wearing headscarves and black ski masks, standing over a bound man in an orange jumpsuit — similar to a prisoner's uniform. The man identified himself as Nick Berg, a U.S. civilian whose body was found Saturday near a highway overpass in Baghdad.


"My name is Nick Berg, my father's name is Michael, my mother's name is Suzanne," the man said on the video. "I have a brother and sister, David and Sarah. I live in ... Philadelphia."


After reading a statement, the men were seen pulling the man to his side and putting a large knife to his neck. A scream sounded as the men cut his head off, shouting "Allahu akbar!" — "God is great!" They then held the head up to the camera.


The slaying recalled the kidnapping and videotaped beheading of Wall Street Journal reporter Daniel Pearl in 2002 in Pakistan. Four Islamic militants have been convicted of kidnapping Pearl, but seven other suspects — including those who allegedly slit his throat — remain at large.


The chief of Iraq's war crimes tribunal, meanwhile, said trials of Saddam Hussein (news - web sites) and others will begin next year, although U.S. officials disputed the statement.


Berg was a small-business owner from West Chester, Pa., a Philadelphia suburb, his family said Tuesday.


"For the mothers and wives of American soldiers, we tell you that we offered the U.S. administration to exchange this hostage with some of the detainees in Abu Ghraib and they refused," one of the men read from a statement.


"So we tell you that the dignity of the Muslim men and women in Abu Ghraib and others is not redeemed except by blood and souls. You will not receive anything from us but coffins after coffins ... slaughtered in this way."


The video bore the title "Abu Musab al-Zarqawi shown slaughtering an American." It was unclear whether al-Zarqawi — a lieutenant of Osama bin Laden (news - web sites) — was shown in the video, or was claiming responsibility for ordering the execution.


The Web site on which the video was posted is known as a clearinghouse for al-Qaida and Islamic extremist groups' statements and tapes.


Photographs of Iraqi prisoners being humiliated have reverberated throughout the Arab world and have intensified anti-Western sentiment.


The head of the U.S.-led occupation of Iraq, L. Paul Bremer, said the soldiers accused of abuses would be brought to justice.


"I find the behavior of these American soldiers completely unacceptable and outrageous," Bremer said in an interview with Associated Press Television News. "I share the outrage of the Iraqi people and the people of the world as to what these guys did. They don't represent America, and they don't represent the face of the American military."


Seven soldiers from the 372nd Military Police Company face charges in the mistreatment of prisoners at Abu Ghraib prison. The first one to go to trial, Spc. Jeremy C. Sivits of Hyndman, Pa., faces a court-martial in Baghdad next week.


The head of Iraq's war crimes tribunal said Tuesday the United States has pledged to hand over Saddam and dozens of other suspects from the ousted regime to Iraqi authorities by the time some sovereignty is restored June 30. U.S. officials disputed that any decisions on timing had been made.


Salem Chalabi said in Kuwait that trials would begin next year and that judges would receive "files" on the suspects at the end of this year.





"We will put 100 people ... including Saddam Hussein, on trial," he said. The suspects, he added, "will be delivered to us by the coalition before the transfer of power."

Secretary of State Colin Powell (news - web sites) said he did not know anything about handing over Saddam. State Department spokesman Richard Boucher also said that as far as he knew there was no decision on when or in what time frame to hand over the ousted Iraqi leader, who has been in U.S. custody since he was captured Dec. 13.

Ali Hassan al-Majid, known as "Chemical Ali" for his use of chemical weapons against the Kurds in the 1980s, could be one of the first to stand trial, Chalabi said.

The United States estimates that Saddam's government killed at least 300,000 Iraqis. Some human rights groups say the number is closer to 1 million.

No charges have yet been filed against Saddam or other suspects from his regime, but human rights groups have said the tribunal expects to try leaders for genocide, war crimes and crimes against humanity.

Berg, 26, had been missing since April 9 — the same day insurgents attacked a U.S. convoy west of the capital.

His family said they were informed Monday by the State Department that Berg was found dead in Baghdad. His mother, Suzanne, said he was in Iraq as an independent businessman to help rebuild communication antennas. He had been missing since April 9, she said.

Suzanne Berg said she was told her son's body would be transported to Kuwait and then to Dover, Del. She said the family had been trying for weeks to learn where their son was but that federal officials had not been helpful. "I basically ended up doing most of the investigating myself," she said.

The Russian Foreign Ministry, meanwhile, said one Russian energy company worker was confirmed dead and two others abducted Monday when gunmen fired on their car south of Baghdad. An Iraqi serving as a bodyguard and translator was wounded, said Yevgeny Loginov, spokesman for the Interenergoservis energy company.

Gunmen attacked a U.S.-run civilian convoy operated by workers hired by a subcontractor of Kellogg Brown & Root in the western desert about 230 miles west of Baghdad. A motorist said he saw six burned vehicles, including one Iraqi civilian car caught in the crossfire.

Halliburton Corp. spokeswoman Wendy Hall said "to our knowledge, all drivers have been accounted for." She said the workers had been hired by a subcontractor for Kellogg Brown & Root, a subsidiary of Halliburton.

April 9 also was the day that seven American contractors working for a subsidiary of Halliburton and two military men disappeared after their supply convoy was attacked on the outskirts of Baghdad. Four of the Halliburton workers and one of the military men have since been confirmed dead. Halliburton worker Thomas Hamill escaped his captors May 2 and returned home to Mississippi on Saturday. The other two Halliburton workers and the other soldier remain missing.

Two military men also vanished; one was later found dead and the other, Pfc. Keith M. Maupin of Batavia, Ohio, was taken captive and remains missing.

Anti-Western sentiment flared following the crackdown on Shiite extremists and the three-week Marine siege of Fallujah west of Baghdad. Sentiment intensified with the publication of photos showing U.S. soldiers abusing and humiliating Iraqis in Abu Ghraib.

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmp..._re_mi_ea/iraq
dlinkwit27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 20:11   #3
LollipopLustKil
Insomniac
(Forum King)
 
LollipopLustKil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 3,033
Send a message via AIM to LollipopLustKil
I heard about that too.

Hannity (from Fox News) also said that if you can find it, the video is out there. Anyone find it yet?

Scotty Doesn't Know
LollipopLustKil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 20:29   #4
ElChevelle
Moderator Alumni
 
ElChevelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: the MANCANNON!
Posts: 22,436
Did he live?
ElChevelle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 21:57   #5
zootm
Forum King
 
zootm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: the nether reaches of bonnie scotland
Posts: 13,375
not for long.

zootm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 22:35   #6
THPSFG
Member
 
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: :morF
Posts: 79
Can you really blame them? They did it for revenge. The same reason we went to war.
THPSFG is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 22:37   #7
LollipopLustKil
Insomniac
(Forum King)
 
LollipopLustKil's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Ohio
Posts: 3,033
Send a message via AIM to LollipopLustKil
But we didn't cut their heads off.

Scotty Doesn't Know
LollipopLustKil is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 22:37   #8
electricmime
Major Dude
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 991
we shot and bombed them

There is no reset button on life... but the graphics kick ass
electricmime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 22:50   #9
ElChevelle
Moderator Alumni
 
ElChevelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: the MANCANNON!
Posts: 22,436
We didn't intentionally kill civilians
ElChevelle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 22:54   #10
electricmime
Major Dude
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Posts: 991
true, but we tortured prisoners of war.. they did the same thing

There is no reset button on life... but the graphics kick ass
electricmime is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 23:02   #11
ElChevelle
Moderator Alumni
 
ElChevelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: the MANCANNON!
Posts: 22,436
Same thing?
Executing a civilian -and- Pissing on a prisoner of war.
Yea, that's really the same thing.
ElChevelle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11th May 2004, 23:30   #12
ujay
Forum King
 
ujay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London
Posts: 6,072
Quote:
Originally posted by ElChevelle
We didn't intentionally kill civilians
Just carelessness eh. Currently around 9,000 lives worth of carelessness.

And in view of your last post Chev - bear in mind that those leading the culture of abuse at Abu Ghraib are 'Civilian contractors' (or mercenaries to give then an alternative title). As usual it's the poor bloody squadie takes the blame.

UJ
ujay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 00:03   #13
manthabeats
Winamp's Cinematographer
(Major Dude)
 
manthabeats's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Hollywood (in 3-6 years)
Posts: 655
Send a message via Yahoo to manthabeats
This is just assinine, I wish this whole god fking damn thing was all over with (the war etc.) We need to find the fkers that did this and behead them as well. This needs to fking stop, and its partially our country's fault as well.

Currently filming: Youtube stuff
My Website
manthabeats is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 00:14   #14
ElChevelle
Moderator Alumni
 
ElChevelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: the MANCANNON!
Posts: 22,436
Quote:
Originally posted by dlinkwit27
Berg was a small-business owner from West Chester, Pa., a Philadelphia suburb, his family said Tuesday. His mother, Suzanne, said he was in Iraq as an independent businessman to help rebuild communication antennas. He had been missing since April 9, she said.
Rebuilding antennaes should have only gotten him his left arm hacked off. Now if he were repairing the potable water system in Iraq, THEN we cut off his head.
ElChevelle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 00:22   #15
baafie
feminazi
(Major Dude)
 
baafie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,767
I think pissing on a POW doesn't fall into the same category as torture.

As I understand it from the news, American soldiers did torture one of them to death. So that does pretty much compare to cutting off that guy's head. Except for that he was a civilian of course.

However - I think that both acts are a disgrace and the ones responsible are poor excuses for human beings.


On a related note, the first Dutch soldier died in Iraq yesterday.
baafie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 00:27   #16
griffinn
Court Jester
(Forum King)
 
griffinn's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Your local toystore
Posts: 3,501
Send a message via ICQ to griffinn
Sort of fitting, since the war on Iraq was kick-started by a "decapitation attack".

The smiley slot machine! | Quotable Blog
griffinn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 00:46   #17
manthabeats
Winamp's Cinematographer
(Major Dude)
 
manthabeats's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Hollywood (in 3-6 years)
Posts: 655
Send a message via Yahoo to manthabeats
Quote:
Originally posted by baafie

However - I think that both acts are a disgrace and the ones responsible are poor excuses for human beings.
I agree 100%

Currently filming: Youtube stuff
My Website
manthabeats is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 00:46   #18
ujay
Forum King
 
ujay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London
Posts: 6,072
Quote:
Originally posted by baafie
... However - I think that both acts are a disgrace and the ones responsible are poor excuses for human beings ...
I agree entirely baafi.

Unfortunately the ability to kill and brutalize a fellow human being is one of the first requirements of military training, in ANY army. Simply blaming the poor buggers in the photos doesn't really come close to where the true evil lies.

UJ
ujay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 01:51   #19
dlinkwit27
has no CT
(Forum King)
 
dlinkwit27's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 13,235
Send a message via ICQ to dlinkwit27 Send a message via AIM to dlinkwit27 Send a message via Yahoo to dlinkwit27
Quote:
Originally posted by ujay
Just carelessness eh. Currently around 9,000 lives worth of carelessness.

UJ
I'd like to see where you get those numbers from. I wonder who is going around with the troops finding out how many of the plainclothed dead people are ciilians or militatns who havn't grabbed their gun yet.
dlinkwit27 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 02:51   #20
manthabeats
Winamp's Cinematographer
(Major Dude)
 
manthabeats's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2001
Location: Hollywood (in 3-6 years)
Posts: 655
Send a message via Yahoo to manthabeats
Kind of ironic that the movie "The Siege" is on USA (on cable) tonight (5/11/04) with all of this current crap going on. In that movie, the United States government needlessly tortures a islamic guy for no reason (and he is naked as well). Again, ironic.

Currently filming: Youtube stuff
My Website
manthabeats is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 02:58   #21
mikeflca
Major Dude
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: san diego, california.
Posts: 623
Quote:
Originally posted by ujay
[B]
Unfortunately the ability to kill and brutalize a fellow human being is one of the first requirements of military training, in ANY army. Simply blaming the poor buggers in the photos doesn't really come close to where the true evil lies.
I disagree with you there. Someone beat up another person so let's blame the whole army, and, even better, a whole country?.....blaming others can be really easy, but it isn't always the right thing to do. I guess that is a real wake-up call to a lot of people out there. Blame is a human tendency that has been getting more common lately, especially in politics......well, I'll save you from my rant....for now.....

and, I agree with whatever baafie said that's probably the best way to look at this.
mikeflca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 03:15   #22
ujay
Forum King
 
ujay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London
Posts: 6,072
If you read that more carefully you will see that I am not blaming the whole army, far from it.

Without blame there is no responsibility, I think it is this that is most lacking.
Having to be responsible is the curse of a democracy for it's leaders and a blessing for it's people

UJ
ujay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 03:20   #23
mikeflca
Major Dude
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: san diego, california.
Posts: 623
I'm not saying blame in itself is bad, but rather the way it is thrown around. Generally, blame from the people towards the govt is good if it forces the govt to be better in some way (yeah i know that sounds horrible but i can't word it any better). But, when the govt is blaming others within the govt, who blame others, and then those other others blame another person.......you get the idea.

But, then, what is that "true evil" that you are talking about?

edit1:Army requirements? if so then you are basically blaming the way the army (or armed forces, whatever) operates.

edit2: And please, the first thing an army looks for is bloodthirstyness or somethuing like that? maybe courage and bravery yes, or intelligence, but not that.

mikeflca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 04:54   #24
marvinbarcelona
Major Dude
 
marvinbarcelona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: m/cr, UK
Posts: 1,143
I've only just woken up and I've heard very little information so far. But there are a couple of points I'm very unclear on;

01. A telecomunications worker leaves his small buisness to travel to Iraqi to find work there and fails. How did he support himself and why couldn't he find work?

02. He was arrested by the police over there and was being removed from the country by the US military. Why? What had he done? Was he a mercenary?

These questions do not excuse what happened to him, but if it turns out he was a mercenary, then I believe it was he own damn fault.

Before I go; I've said in previous posts that the people of the US would loose their minds if something happened to one of their citizens....guess what, it seems they are getting mighty upset.

The figures on Iraqi deaths is very well known and 9,000 is a little on the conservative side.

It's been said that I could start an arguement in an empty room.....I see no reason to disbelieve this.
marvinbarcelona is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 05:11   #25
d0rk
I contribute nothing.
(Forum King)
 
d0rk's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Location: Virgacalementoflagantionio
Posts: 3,030
Quote:
Originally posted by LollipopLustKil
I heard about that too.

Hannity (from Fox News) also said that if you can find it, the video is out there. Anyone find it yet?

I have it. PM me for the link to my ftp.

I came for the hatred.
I stayed for the ballbag.
d0rk is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 05:56   #26
Wildrose-Wally
The Albertan
 
Join Date: Mar 2001
Posts: 6,122
Quote:
Originally posted by marvinbarcelona
I've only just woken up and I've heard very little information so far. But there are a couple of points I'm very unclear on;

01. A telecomunications worker leaves his small buisness to travel to Iraqi to find work there and fails. How did he support himself and why couldn't he find work?

02. He was arrested by the police over there and was being removed from the country by the US military. Why? What had he done? Was he a mercenary?

These questions do not excuse what happened to him, but if it turns out he was a mercenary, then I believe it was he own damn fault.

Before I go; I've said in previous posts that the people of the US would loose their minds if something happened to one of their citizens....guess what, it seems they are getting mighty upset.

The figures on Iraqi deaths is very well known and 9,000 is a little on the conservative side.
Your behaviour on these forums disgusts me. You are the type who is the first to condemn the Americans for the prison abuses, but if an American civillian is brutally murdered by those barbarians, you are insinuating he was a mercenary, and thereby implying he deserved it.

The prison abuses don't come even close to the brutality these animals are capable off.
Wildrose-Wally is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 06:44   #27
deeder7001
Jesus Freak
(Forum King)
 
deeder7001's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Location: Tempe, AZ
Posts: 5,520
Send a message via AIM to deeder7001 Send a message via Yahoo to deeder7001
i haven't even heard about this until i saw the thread a few minutes ago. i've heard of the abuse of the prisoners also from these forums. those beaten were POWs. the person that was beheaded was a CIVILIAN not a damn soldier. he did not deserve that. no innocent person deserves to have their head cut off like that.

Marvin seems to be anti-american at this point. from what i've heard the guy was not a fuckin' mercenary.

There is no sig.
deeder7001 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 10:11   #28
griffinn
Court Jester
(Forum King)
 
griffinn's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2000
Location: Your local toystore
Posts: 3,501
Send a message via ICQ to griffinn
One death is a tragedy. A million deaths is a statistic. -- Josef Stalin

The smiley slot machine! | Quotable Blog
griffinn is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 10:50   #29
zootm
Forum King
 
zootm's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: the nether reaches of bonnie scotland
Posts: 13,375
Quote:
Originally posted by deeder7001
i haven't even heard about this until i saw the thread a few minutes ago. i've heard of the abuse of the prisoners also from these forums. those beaten were POWs. the person that was beheaded was a CIVILIAN not a damn soldier. he did not deserve that. no innocent person deserves to have their head cut off like that.
the people who did it hardly had the iraqi peoples' seal of approval, though, did they?

unlike the soldiers that we sent out to do what they did. this is why caution should be exercised in military operations.

irish terrorists have killed hundreds, yet we don't say that ireland endorses terrorism. anyone who thinks that sentence is obvious, should not be comparing this to the abuse of prisoners.

zootm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 13:29   #30
WomanOfHeart
Major Dudette
 
WomanOfHeart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Somewhere no one can find me...in my own head.
Posts: 978
Quote:
Originally posted by marvinbarcelona

He was arrested by the police over there and was being removed from the country by the US military. Why? What had he done? Was he a mercenary?

These questions do not excuse what happened to him, but if it turns out he was a mercenary, then I believe it was he own damn fault.
Where did you read that he was being removed from the country by the US military? The only thing I've read is that he was looking for a way to get home because he wasn't finding any work. I seriously doubt he was a mercenary, especially since he went over there of his own accord. The police over there will arrest people for just looking at them the wrong way. They don't need an excuse or reasonable cause.

WomanOfHeart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 13:51   #31
ElChevelle
Moderator Alumni
 
ElChevelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2000
Location: the MANCANNON!
Posts: 22,436
He fabricates (never provides links) to further his agenda.
ElChevelle is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 14:57   #32
hgnis
Hobbit Humper
Forum King
 
hgnis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: banned camp
Posts: 4,119
I think it is just another sad reflection of what this world is today. It was only a matter of time after the prison camp pictures were released before something like that happened. The picture thing didn't suprise me one bit. What else would you have expected from the Generation Fuckup? Everything has given to them, not a day of true hardship and when something happens blame everyone except themselves. (Oh it was my CO that ordered me to do it....wtf? wtf?)
Now this, a life for a naked picture. By arab millitant reasoning THAT is a fair trade. People on the radio here were saying we should bomb a mosque for every american killed - similar to what the Romans usually did to a conquered people. Brutal, but it worked. Where is the stupidity to end?
One should expect no civilized action of the part of the islamic millitants, where have they ever proven they can peacefully coexist with anything? While this is not true of the majority, one needs to keep in mind the anti west (not even american) propaganda even the most tolerant of muslim ally countries are being fed through the media.
It is easy for the clerics/arab media/arab governments to blame the Western governments and people for any problems they have. The ignorant masses (yes, masses are always ignorant that is why they are so easy to control) are always too ready to find a scapegoat than to examine themselves and their own flaws. This has always been the case. Even in the west - find a fall guy, I am not responsible.
As soon as I have destroyed OZ and Romefeller the empire will all change. TRUST ME.

I am so important I feel the need to let it be known like a liberal discovering the internets for the first time. Uh hur hur hur. I also wash myself with a rag on a stick.
Realitybites
<3
hgnis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 15:12   #33
baafie
feminazi
(Major Dude)
 
baafie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,767
Quote:
Originally posted by hgnis
(Oh it was my CO that ordered me to do it....wtf? wtf?)
That same argument was used in post-war trials by nazis who tortured/killed jews and other civilians.

A soldier is given a choice: either he does as he is told to do, or he will die. And that is not much of a choice for most soldiers.
baafie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 15:19   #34
hgnis
Hobbit Humper
Forum King
 
hgnis's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2002
Location: banned camp
Posts: 4,119
As I said before, Generation Fuckup is too weak to stand on their own two damn feet. Where are the COs? One wonders.

I am so important I feel the need to let it be known like a liberal discovering the internets for the first time. Uh hur hur hur. I also wash myself with a rag on a stick.
Realitybites
<3
hgnis is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 16:14   #35
baafie
feminazi
(Major Dude)
 
baafie's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,767
Quote:
Originally posted by hgnis
As I said before, Generation Fuckup is too weak to stand on their own two damn feet. Where are the COs? One wonders.
You know, the nazis were of the previous generation, and/or the ones before

Common soldiers are taught not to stand on their own feet. They're taught to follow orders.

I'm guessing the CO's are still in Iraq, which should give them US army plenty of opportunity to cover the whole thing up.
baafie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 16:39   #36
marvinbarcelona
Major Dude
 
marvinbarcelona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: m/cr, UK
Posts: 1,143
Quote:
Originally posted by ElChevelle
He fabricates (never provides links) to further his agenda.
I do provide links, but as I said in my post, I'd only just woken up, heard sketchy reports on my radio and had some questions that were answered in the news reports. The news report certainly did state that he had been arrested by the Iraqis;

"Senor told reporters that Berg, 26, from West Chester, Pennsylvania, was detained by Iraqi police in Mosul. The Iraqis informed the Americans and the FBI met with Berg three times to determine what he was doing in Iraq"

CBS

Edited because I'm alot calmer now.

Here's another bit from the same article;

"The family says Berg was turned over to U.S. officials and detained for 13 days. His father, Michael, said his son wasn't allowed to make phone calls or contact a lawyer. On April 5, the Bergs filed suit in federal court in Philadelphia, contending that their son was being held illegally by the U.S. military."

People, I am not anti-American. I know you guys find it hard to understand when someone dosen't agree with American policy, but hey, I live in a democracy where people are allowed to hold opinions different from everyone else.

Please point out where I have been anti-American. Now, thats different from being anti-American goverment....see the difference?

I like to think of myself as the ultimate patriot. When the goverment of my country does something that I don't agree with, then I voice my opinion and point of view. That is my democratic right and I believe that I am upholding the priniciples of democracy my holding my goverment to account for its actions. Actions that have been done in my name. I also hold other countries goverments to account for the wrong they have done. I don't condemn the people as a whole, only those responsible for the wrong doing.

Do we understand this? To have an opinion that is different from the opinion of the US, is not anti-American. Do you guys understand this? Is it fairly clear?

Jeez, you guys really hate anyone with a different opinion don't you?

It's been said that I could start an arguement in an empty room.....I see no reason to disbelieve this.
marvinbarcelona is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 16:41   #37
ujay
Forum King
 
ujay's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2001
Location: London
Posts: 6,072
Quote:
Originally posted by mikeflca
But, then, what is that "true evil" that you are talking about?

edit1:Army requirements? if so then you are basically blaming the way the army (or armed forces, whatever) operates.

edit2: And please, the first thing an army looks for is bloodthirstyness or somethuing like that? maybe courage and bravery yes, or intelligence, but not that.
The true evil is that those who profit from this war are not the ones who make the sacrifices.

edit1: It can't operate in any other way and still be effective as an army, this is it's nature and something that cannot be blamed.

edit2: Outside of Hollywood it is very difficult to get your ordinary decent human being to kill another. It is, and always has been, the most difficult part of military conditioning, simply because the supply of bloodthirsty maniacs is so small. All the tactical training in the world is useless if the willingness to use it is absent.

UJ
ujay is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 16:59   #38
WomanOfHeart
Major Dudette
 
WomanOfHeart's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Somewhere no one can find me...in my own head.
Posts: 978
"(CBS/AP) The American man who was decapitated on a videotape posted by an al Qaeda-linked Web site was never under U.S. custody despite claims from his family, coalition spokesman Dan Senor said Wednesday.

Senor told reporters that Berg, 26, from West Chester, Pennsylvania, was detained by Iraqi police in Mosul. The Iraqis informed the Americans and the FBI met with Berg three times to determine what he was doing in Iraq.

Senor said that to his knowledge, "he (Berg) was at no time under the jurisdiction or detention of coalition forces."

This is the beginning of the article which marvin linked to. Read the entire article, then decide for yourselves whether he was detained by the US or not. Sounds to me like he wasn't.

WomanOfHeart is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 17:18   #39
marvinbarcelona
Major Dude
 
marvinbarcelona's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: m/cr, UK
Posts: 1,143
WomanOfHeart, as I said in my first post, this is news I woke up to this morning, so I didn't have the full story, only a brief outline. That is why I said I had a couple of questions...thats me quoting myself below;

Quote:
I've only just woken up and I've heard very little information so far. But there are a couple of points I'm very unclear on;
Heres another bit;

Quote:
These questions do not excuse what happened to him
What he was doing in Iraq is still in doubt and as WomanofHeart has pointed out, whether he was under arrested or not is also unclear.

It's been said that I could start an arguement in an empty room.....I see no reason to disbelieve this.
marvinbarcelona is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12th May 2004, 17:56   #40
scootiedude
Junior Member
 
Join Date: May 2004
Location: North Carolina.
Posts: 14
Another U.S. civilian killed in Iraq!

I think that it's a terrible atrocity that terrorists commited against Nick Berg. This isn't the first instance where a hostage has been killed since the invasion of Iraq by the U.S.A., and it more than likely won't be the last. The only difference in this killing and some of the previous ones, was the fact that it was videotaped and put on an Internet web site.
scootiedude is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply
Go Back   Winamp & Shoutcast Forums > Community Center > Breaking News

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump