Old 11th April 2007, 06:58   #1
TheGriffinman
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Track-to-track volume leveling(?)

I have thousands of mp3's and wma's, etc, on my PC of all different bit-rates. Can Winamp be set up to level the volume of music files as they're played from track-to-track so that some songs don't come over as overbearing while others I have to strain to hear?
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Old 11th April 2007, 13:05   #2
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Yes, but you need to ReplayGain scan your entire collection first.

Go to: Winamp > Prefs (Ctrl+P) > Playback
Checkmark "Use Replay Gain"

The default 'Amplification Mode' and 'Preferred Source' settings should suffice, but you can always adjust them later, if needs be (eg. I prefer 'album' mode instead of 'track').

The default 'preamp' value for 'Adjustment for files without RG' is -6.0 dB
If you find that any tracks without RG yet applied are playing too quietly, then you may wish to increase this value a bit, eg. to -4.0 dB or -2.5 dB, etc.


Now go to: Prefs > Plugins > Media Library > ReplayGain Analyzer > config
(for 5.59 and above, settings are also on: Prefs -> Playback -> Replay Gain tab)

For batch analysis, I recommend that you checkmark "Ask after all files are scanned"

Note, if you uncheck 'Ask before writing to files' then the RG values will be applied silently, after all selected files have been scanned.
The default behaviour is to apply Album gain, which also auto-applies Track gain, but not vice-versa (ie. manually applying Track gain will not also apply Album gain).

I definitely recommend applying/using 'Album' gain.

Close Prefs


If you haven't done so already, import all your music into the Local Media database in the Media Library (or load all files into the Playlist Editor window).

Because RG Analysis is quite a cpu intensive operation, I recommend that you do it in stages, eg. batches of a few hundred files at once.

Or you can do it overnight if you wish (probably best to do this in silent mode, ie. uncheck 'ask before writing to files' in prefs).

Do a test run first of a couple of albums.

Select the album tracks in the ML or Playlist Editor
(use ctrl+click or shift+click to select multiple items)
Right click the first selected item
Select: Send To > Calculate Replay Gain

When all files have been scanned and RG values applied, they should all playback at approximately the same volume.

The reason why I prefer Album mode (Prefs > Playback) is because Track mode sometimes gets it wrong for one or two files, especially if the first track on the album is just a short quiet intro track.
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Old 11th April 2007, 23:17   #3
TheGriffinman
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I greatly appreciate your help, and was able to follow your instructions, but I ran into a problem, several of my files won't play once I've applied the gain. They still play if I turn RG off, so it's not a loss, but I can't seem to find a happy medium...(???) The only way I can get them all to play with RG on is if I set amplification mode to "prevent clipping", which doesn't seem to level the volume.
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Old 11th April 2007, 23:49   #4
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Well there is an alternative... MP3Gain
...which is what I used for my ENTIRE collection.

Although, I also know that you really don't recommend it, Egg ...
Quote:
Originally posted by DJ Egg
Also note that ReplayGain is supported by more players than just Winamp. Besides that, I've never trusted mp3gain personally, heh, and it doesn't work for ogg, flac, wma, m4a/aac anyway - whereas RG does.
But then again, my entire collection is practically all MP3.

@TheGriffinman...

As Egg indicated, if you have mostly ogg, flac, wma, m4a/aac, then forget MP3Gain. If on the other hand you have all Mp3's, then I reccommend it.

Don't email or PM me concerning Winamp. Instead, either start a NEW TOPIC or post a REPLY in the appropriate thread in these forums. This will also benefit others who may have a similar question or problem. But before posting, please first Search the forums and read all FAQs and all Sticky threads.

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Old 11th April 2007, 23:51   #5
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Hmm, strange.


What version of Winamp are you using?
5.33 public release, 5.34 public beta, or some older version?


What file format are the problem files? MP3 or WMA, or other?

Are any of the problem files encoded in multi-channel format (eg. 5.1ch surround)?

There was a bug in older (pre 5.33) versions where it would set something stupid like -24601 dB gain for surroundsound encoded files.

Could you posibly upload one of the problem files to eg. sendspace.com, stashbox.org, or mediafire.com, and post the download link here?

(don't worry if it shows as 'url submitted by user' in your reply, as that's just part of the forum's antispam policy for anyone with Junior Member status, but moderators/admin can still see the url).


You could also attach a List of Plugins, which might reveal some extra/relevant info.


[edit]

Hi Nunzio! :-) Yeah, I still don't recommend mp3gain over RG, but hey...
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Old 11th April 2007, 23:54   #6
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Old 12th April 2007, 01:07   #7
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Nunzio, thanks for the pointer, but, while I've uploaded a lot of my music from my CD collection in mp3 format, I've also purchased a lot of music from Urge, Puretracks, etc, and have a lot of WMA's. The advice doesn't go unappreciated!

Egg, thanks for sticking with me! I'm running the 5.33 public release. At first glance it appears that my problem files are all WMA's, in fact, I'm pretty sure they're all songs I downloaded from Urge. I only ran the RG on one playlist of 92 files.

Does the RG make permanent changes to the files, or does it just save info on the file to tell Winamp how to adjust the settings? Can you tell I'm a bit over my head here?

I didn't pay real close attention to the settings after it calculated the gain, but I definately noticed it did in fact set several of the files at "something stupid like -24601 dB", so that would appear to be my problem(?)

The files in question, that I bought off of Urge through WMP 11 won't even play in WMP 11, (yes, I just said I downloaded them through WMP, and they won't play in WMP, can you say "Microsoft"? LOL!), they're embedded with some media rites code, (so I guess), but they play in Winamp just fine...until I try to run the RG on them.

You're way over my head with the multi-channel flux copasitor thig-a-mu-jig, so I can't help you there, but I uploaded one of the files here; http://www.sendspace.com/file/mxillo

One piece of info I felt may be important is that these files appear to be playing when the RG is on, the file name appears in Winamp, the scroll bar scrolls and the counter counts, and everything appears as it normally would, so if I was deaf we'd be good.

I kid, but I really do appreciate your help! I'm a truck driver, and my music is important to me, it makes the miles go by a lot easier...I take my music seriously, and I'd really like to get this right! Thanks again!
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Old 12th April 2007, 01:26   #8
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Here's my plugin list.
Attached Files
File Type: txt my_plugin_list.txt (4.5 KB, 465 views)
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Old 12th April 2007, 02:29   #9
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Another interesting note, I tried to convert a couple of these aforementioned files to mp3, and the outcome was a 2 KB file of, well, nothing as far as I could tell. I really think it's got something to do with some sort of copyright code embedded in the files(?)
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Old 12th April 2007, 02:54   #10
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Ok, we've found a bug... :-)

Those files are DRM-protected WMA's (ie. they require a license to play, and once acquired, will only play on the pc they were purchased/downloaded on, ie. yours, but not mine or anyone else's).

The RG Analyzer should be skipping over any DRM'd files, because technically, it probably would not be legal for us to modify those files... infact, I'm not even sure if it's possible to apply RG to DRM'd WMA's.

The proposed fix for 5.34 Final will be that you can run them through the RG Analyzer again, and it'll remove the -24601 dB Album & Track values that it's erroneously applied (that's why the tracks play but you can't hear anything, because -24601 dB is well beyond silence).

We apologize greatly for the inconvenience caused by this bug.


ps. Yeah, you can't convert DRM'd WMA's to any other format, not with Winamp anyway.
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Old 12th April 2007, 03:51   #11
TheGriffinman
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Outstanding, I'm glad I could help you locate a bug. That's what I get for paying for music, I guess.

Don't apologize to me for this inconvenience, nonsense! The inconvenience isn't created by Winamp!...now I've got to replace all these songs I paid for...back to pirating. I really was trying to be good! Well, I can't feel bad about pirating music I've already paid for, but I won't be paying for anymore downloads, for sure.

Some of those "DRM" songs were the reason I needed the gain in the first place, what point is it to pay for music and have such limited access to it, when you can...well, you know where I'm going with this.

I'm very impressed with your response time and service. I had gotten away from Winamp several years, several computers ago when WMP 6 or 7 came out, and wasn't so bad. WMP11 is garbage, and 10 isn't compatable to Vista, so when WMP11 wouldn't play my DRM's, I came straight to Winamp. I won't go back.

Thanks so much for your help. Now, if you'll excuse me, I've got some downloading to do!
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Old 12th April 2007, 04:54   #12
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Aha! You have been EGGED!!!
But we already know of Egg's invaluable worth and expertise in these forums

This is his list of CROWNING achievements...



ROYAL REGMEISTER
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SpybotSD log SPECIALIST
HijackThis log SPECIALIST
Tech Support GRANDMEISTER
Founding member:
Post Edit GRANDMEISTERS Society


And of course, the response time and service that you mentioned above go hand-in-hand with his being our resident Tech Support GRANDMEISTER!!
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Old 12th April 2007, 05:41   #13
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You guys are too cool. I'm on iMesh redownloading my music, but I'm running into the same problem with with those downloads. I need a pirate's help here, I think...How can I rip the DRM out of my WMA's and make them compatible with RG, or convert them to MP3? Don't tell me it can't be done, where there's a will... I don't think burning them will work, I can burn them and play them in my head unit, but I tried that to get them to play in WMP11 and that didn't work. I need a hacker! You see, try to be a law abiding citizen, and you get screwed...
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Old 12th April 2007, 12:44   #14
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For legal reasons, I can't really provide much (if any) detail here about filesharing and the removal of drm. All I'm going to say is search google for FairUse4WM, and the rest is up to you.

However, why don't you download MP3 versions of the songs instead of WMA?

Oh, and is iMesh adware/spyware-free these days?
I know it used to come bundled with a plethora of crap.
http://www3.ca.com/securityadvisor/p...x?id=453072738

Maybe try emule, or any other(s) marked as "YY" in this article:
http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?threadid=64964

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Hehehehe, is good to see ^that^ again. It's been a while :-)
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Old 12th April 2007, 13:34   #15
TheGriffinman
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No, I hadn't used iMesh in years because of the adware, I just started using the latest version very recently since upgrading to Vista, my Shareaza doesn't seem near as sufficient as it used to be. I'm really happy with the new iMesh so far for music, except I haven't found how to choose between formats yet, (I've had it for less than a week). I remember the adware and banners in the old iMesh, I used to get hacked versions.

I appreciate the help...again. I understand you've got to be careful how far you go, but I'm pretty resourceful for finding things, a little nod in the right direction, like you offered ought to be plenty to get me there. Thanks again!
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Old 12th April 2007, 13:41   #16
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@TheGriffinman...

Not admitting that I "condone" the use of file-sharing P2P apps...
I still prefer the *moderator's pick* of Soulseek for MP3 acquisition.

@Egg...

The kudos and accolades are well-deserved.
You've EARNED them!
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Old 15th April 2007, 20:36   #17
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Man, this is soo frustrating. The files I was downloading from iMesh are also DRM protected, even though they're free d/l's(???), so I can't use RG on them either... I've tried the old sound recorder trick, you know...plug your mic jack into your headphone jack...using Easy Hi-Q recorder, but I can't even get that to work. FairUse isn't compatible with my latest version of WMP... I've even tried TuneBite, and...I don't know, something else...nothing works. It looks like the pendulum has swung in favor of the evil microsoft and music industry...for the time being...

I'm a truck driver, so I'm limited to wireless internet...better than dial-up, but not exactly cable or DSL, know what I mean? It is a very painfully long process for me to replace these 50 some odd WMA's with MP3's via P2P. I've got a lot of files sitting on "Pending" in Shareaza, and I got SoulSeek as suggested by Nunzio. SoulSeek is my most effective fix for now, but I still get a lot of "Awaiting User", "Remotely Queued", and "Transfer Failed". Plus I'm having trouble finding some of the files I'm looking for, like Leland Martin, seems no one's heard of him, but "Stone Cold Fingers" is a must for a truck driver's playlist, and I can't seem to find "Prisoner of the Highway" by Mark Wills, along with several other somewhat less important songs. Mystikal's "Big Truck Driver" along with Metallica's "Wherever I May Roam" puts a nice twist in my mostly classic rock/country playlist, and I've got a great system in this truck! As Tom Petty would say, "the waiting is the hardest part".

My music is important to me on this road, the miles go by so much easier...You guy's are the only one's who seem eager to help...I've been waiting three days for a reply from a post on TuneBite's forums. Can you please, please, please keep me informed of any new breakthroughs?! Getting RG to work on my DRM WMA's is my main, short term concern, my intentions are to get rid of DRM and convert all of my files to mp3. It's a VERY slow process for me through p2p, probably weeks, at least. I know you're not supposed to support hacking and pirating tools here, but remember, we're talking about music that I already PAID for. If you catch wind of anything new, please keep me posted. In the meantime, I'll be queued up in someone's d/l list... >(
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Old 25th April 2007, 15:23   #18
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I may have found another bug for you. If you're trying to convert a bulk of WMA's to MP3 and you mistakenly get an MP3 caught up in your conversion, that MP3 will be lost, it'll be overwritten with a 24.0 KB file that plays the first second of the song. I was trying to convert all my non DRM protected WMA's to MP3 and I accidently got "W.M.A." by Pearl Jam, (which is...was an MP3), caught up in there. No big deal, I'll get it back, just thought I'd give you the heads up.

Update; I've replaced all my DRM protected files with MP3's via SoulSeek, Shareaza, and a good MP3 store I found, GoMusic.Ru, where you can purchase unproteced MP3's @ $.19 per file, as opposed to DRM protected WMA's @ $.99. I figured my pirating venture might take me overseas...I've replaced all but one of my songs, a little hard to find track called "Cowboy of the Highway" by Riders in the Sky.

Thanks again, Egg and Nunzio, for all your help!
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Old 25th April 2007, 16:44   #19
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Yup. Both bugs are fixed in 5.34

DRM'ed WMA files are now skipped over by the RG Analyzer.
And if the source & destination file are the same, then the Transcoder pops up an error message to let you know.

Also, you might find something of interest here:
http://forums.winamp.com/showthread.php?threadid=52406
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Old 20th November 2010, 08:27   #20
skynyrdfanforeve
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DJ Egg View Post
Yes, but you need to ReplayGain scan your entire collection first.

Go to: Winamp > Prefs (Ctrl+P) > Playback
Checkmark "Use Replay Gain"

The default 'Amplification Mode' and 'Preferred Source' settings should suffice, but you can always adjust them later, if needs be (eg. I prefer 'album' mode instead of 'track').

The default 'preamp' value for 'Adjustment for files without RG' is -6.0 dB
If you find that any tracks without RG yet applied are playing too quietly, then you may wish to increase this value a bit, eg. to -4.0 dB or -2.5 dB, etc.


Now go to: Prefs > Plugins > Media Library > ReplayGain Analyzer > config
For batch analysis, I recommend that you checkmark "ask after all files are scanned"

Note, if you uncheck 'ask before writing to files' then the RG values will be applied silently, after all selected files have been scanned.
The default behaviour is to apply Album gain, which also auto-applies Track gain, but not vice-versa (ie. manually applying Track gain will not also apply Album gain).

I definitely recommend applying/using 'Album' gain.

Close Prefs


If you haven't done so already, import all your music into the Local Media database in the Media Library (or load all files into the Playlist Editor window).

Because RG Analysis is quite a cpu intensive operation, I recommend that you do it in stages, eg. batches of a few hundred files at once.

Or you can do it overnight if you wish (probably best to do this in silent mode, ie. uncheck 'ask before writing to files' in prefs).

Do a test run first of a couple of albums.

Select the album tracks in the ml or pledit
(use ctrl+click or shift+click to select multiple items)
Right click the first selected item
Select: Send To > Calculate Replay Gain

When all files have been scanned and RG values applied, they should all playback at approximately the same volume.

The reason why I prefer Album mode (Prefs > Playback) is because Track mode sometimes gets it wrong for one or two files, especially if the first track on the album is just a short quiet intro track.
Will this level volumes when burning cd compilations? and make each tracks volume the same?
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Old 20th November 2010, 18:02   #21
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two things discussed here:

RG = Replay Gain, which is a tag value. on playback, the app uses the value and adjusts the gain. you can have "track gain" (best for random, shuffled tracks) or "album gain" (best for sequential album playback).

Mp3gain = a way to adjust the actual audio, not a tag, and therefore it works with ANYTHING it is used with on playback. but i don't use it, as i would never vandalize the audio that way by directly applying gain to it, and i don't know if it differentiates between track/album or how it could even. (not my concern, i would never use it)

if you want to use RG, all you have to do is make sure that your album in question has all the same album and albumartist tags, and then run the RG analysis on them. at that point, 4 tags will be written to the files for RG. then just tell winamp or whatever to use RG on playback. i use it and it works VERY well. one app i use is called Squeezebox Server and its smart enough to know (via the playlist) which type of RG should be used! i only wish winamp were as smart, (it isn't yet)

somehow, i doubt winamp applies RG values when burning a CD comp. i suppose it could take track values into account, but idk that it does.

if i make a comp, i take the CDs, rip to wavs, import to audacity, "normalize" each track, and then export to a single wav i burn to CD with EAC, using a cue sheet to create the TOC.

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