Old 12th February 2006, 15:58   #1
ulillillia
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Winamp Pro - converting to MP3 question

I finally got my long-wanted MP3 player. It comes with conversion software, but is way too limited for my needs. It doesn't go below 32 Kbps (I use 16 quite often), and I can't use a sample rate of something like 11,025, which is also what I use (it sounds bad otherwise and I hate high frequencies (above 3K)). Although it does let me choose between Mono and Stereo, that's only plus side to it. I can't tell any significant difference between Stereo and Mono so I'd rather save disk space and use mono.

I did find such a converter, dBPowerAmp (or something like that), but it's only a trial and will only be temporary. I like this program because not only does it work and have full support for 8-bit WAVs and 8 Kbps bit rates (wished it supported 12 and 20 as well as I could make use of these), it also lets me choose the sample rate (usually 11,025 is what I use) and whether to use stereo or mono (I always use mono as I can't tell the difference between stereo).

Does Winamp Pro support all this:
1. Support for 8 Kbps bit rates for MP3
2. Support for 8-bit WAV files
3. Can choose the output sample rate (such as 8000, 11025, 12000, and, rarely, 16000, the standard ones)
4. Choose between Mono and Stereo
5. When converting, it should not cut off the start and end of each song or recordings (I plan on putting some of my stories in there as well, but this is debated on).

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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Old 12th February 2006, 16:04   #2
gaekwad2
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1. Yes
2. Don't know
3. No.
4. Yes.
5. Yes.

CDex allows to set the sample rate.
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Old 12th February 2006, 16:11   #3
billyvnilly
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2.its under the .wav output, so yes?


[edit]to below, oops sorry i should learn to read. so youre talking about maybe using will's transcoder?
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Old 12th February 2006, 16:22   #4
ulillillia
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Not sure on 8-bit. Here's a quick sample so you can test it (note: ZIP file (a zipped up WAV file at ~106 KB)). 95% of my recordings are 8-bit which is why this is very important to me.

I'm not referring to converting to WAV, I'm referring to converting to MP3. Normally 8-bit WAVs are converted to 16-bit (by multiplying each sample's position by 257, I think) which is okay, but having to do this manually is a pain, given that 200 MB in WAV becomes 400 MB....

Can you convert this 8-bit WAV file into MP3 successfully? I'll look into that CDex thing though.

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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Old 12th February 2006, 17:32   #5
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It wouldnt work using Will's transcoder using 5.2beta pro. transcoder just has an unknown crash.
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Old 12th February 2006, 17:47   #6
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Seems like another bug has been found. It shouldn't crash like that. I don't know if WAV files use signed or unsigned integers. The results are maximized if they were unsigned, as you'd just multiply the 8-bit values by 257 to convert to 16-bit (255×257=65535, and 65535 is the highest 16-bit goes (unsigned)) and from these unsigned values, just subtract 32768 to get the signed values if WAV files use signed values. I don't know real programming, but I'm a math whiz so this comes easy to me. Computers use nothing more than numbers to do their operations (including playing your favorite song).

Edit: As a side note, Winamp does play 8-bit WAV files without any trouble so it's not Winamp at fault. I've got one playing right now and it plays just fine like any other edittor.

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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Old 14th February 2006, 03:46   #7
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Does anyone know? Does it work with a nonbeta release of that converter? My MP3 player is otherwise useless without this. It supports WMA's, but I'm unfamiliar with those.

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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Old 14th February 2006, 04:48   #8
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i know if you have lame_enc.dll, audacity will convert to mp3.

with the lame_enc.dll packaged with winamp beta, i got your 196kb file down to 64kb mp3 file.

the encoder works, just im not sure if you can use winamp do do it...
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Old 14th February 2006, 12:59   #9
ujay
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The problem with Winamp seems to be the sample rate.
Winamp will convert these files but seems to assume they are whatever sample rate you are outputing i.e. in this case the result will be stretched out to {(original sample rate)/(final sample rate) = 50/8 = 6.25} times as long. See attatched.

The other samples were prepared in WaveLab, maybe Audacity can do this too.

UJ
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Old 14th February 2006, 19:04   #10
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What Winamp seems to be doing is that it is first converting the sample rate in the original WAV to the output value then encodes the WAV to MP3. I know because I use a hex edittor to change the sample rate (as doing this doesn't affect the WAV itself, no WAV-editting program does this from what I've seen (not audacity - it affects the entire WAV and after 200 changes, the WAV is degraded considerably).

I do happen to have lame_enc.dll, but three copies of it in various locations (one from Winamp itself, another from that dBPowerAmp, and a third from what I got with my MP3 player) with "last modified" dates ranging from Feb 2004 to Feb 2006. I tried testing it with Audacity, but it says that it can't find the lame_enc.dll even though there are 3 instances of it....

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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Old 14th February 2006, 19:44   #11
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Can't really help with Audacity I'm afraid.

lame_enc.dll usually needs to be placed in the same directory as the program that calls it, or in some cases the program itself has a setting that points to it. Maybe it will be found if you put it in ...\system32\ don't know.

If gaekwad's around he can probably tell you which is the latest stable build and where to get it.

UJ
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Old 14th February 2006, 19:52   #12
gaekwad2
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In Audacity:

File > Preferences > File Formats tab > MP3 export setup: find library
Then browse to any one of the lame_enc.dlls you have.

Audacity only supports mp3 export with constant bitrate, but if the source is an 8-bit wav the quality difference between cbr and vbr probably won't matter.
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Old 14th February 2006, 19:52   #13
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It seems like through these tests done by other users, there are some bugs in Winamp when it comes to converting WAV to MP3. It crashes when working with 8-bit WAV files, and the speed isn't kept the same when converting (might be that CDex plug-in, or whatever you're using).

I know MP3 has a license that you have to pay for (unsure why - probably the downloaded music issue is my best guess) which bothers me. My MP3 player came with one, but what features it has is far more limited than even Winamp is (even with the bugs from using Winamp). It don't go below 32 Kbps and only lets me choose from stereo or mono. I haven't tested 8-bit support though using it. Does this mean, to get an update, that I need to buy the license again? If so, how much is it?

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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Old 14th February 2006, 20:01   #14
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Audacity doesn't have any real options to convert with, just setting the bit rate and that's it (and it doesn't have 8, but does have 16)! Where's the other options at?

Edit: Well, the sample rate part is fixed (I tend to forget about the "project rate" thing on the bottom left), but where's the 8 Kbps setting?

Other options as in choosing between stereo and mono, and the rest of what I need.

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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Old 14th February 2006, 20:56   #15
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Yeah, Audacity's output options are quite limited.

There's a (legal) trick to get free mp3 encoding with dbpoweramp though.

You have to get lame.exe (from a bundle here, I'd use the 3.97 beta one), unzip it somewhere, then from the dbpoweramp start menu group select Create Generic CLI.
Enter some name and press the select button to browse to lame.exe.

Now you can select it in the music converter, but you have to know the proper command line.

For 8kbps it's
-b 8 [infile] [outfile]
For other bitrates change the number after -b (allowed values for cbr are 8, 16, 24 etc. (doesn't look like you're interested in higher values anyway))

(Or you could use --abr instead of -b, then it would allow you to use any (integer) bitrate between 8 and 320.)

To manually change the sample rate add eg.
--resample 11
before [infile]

And/or change the cutoff frequency by using eg.
--lowpass 2500

(lame usually selects the best ones itself though, eg. at 8kbps mono it uses 8khz samplerate and 3000hz lowpass)

And to switch to mono (only matters if the source is stereo):
-mm
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Old 14th February 2006, 21:56   #16
ulillillia
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There is no "Create Generic CLI" start menu item at all. I don't know where you're getting this from (a typo or mistake).

All my sources are Mono.

Basically, what're you're saying to batch convert using dBpowerAMP is to have this:

-b 8 --resample 11 [infile] [outfile]

doesn't the "resample 11" give 11 Hz sample rate? Does it support 12 Kbps bit rates?

Currently, I'm using Audacity to do the conversions (it takes 3 minutes per song (care for 230 MB of pure WAV to convert?)

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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Old 14th February 2006, 22:13   #17
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I thought Generic CLI was part of the standard dbpoweramp install.

Oh well, you can download it separately here.

That command line is correct.

--resample 11 and 11025 both produce 11.025kHz sample rate, 11Hz isn't possible with mp3. (Similarly you could also use eg. --lowpass 4.)

12 kbps is only possible if you use --abr (average bitrate) ie.

--abr 12 --resample 11 [infile] [outfile]
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Old 14th February 2006, 22:39   #18
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It still keeps erroring. It says "codec error". I mentioned earlier that dBpowerAMP seems to not find the codec even though it's there. It gets to 10% finished then the error occurs. It doesn't seem to be the 230 MB file size as I tried my 4.7 MB sample and I still get the same error. What could be causing this?

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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Old 14th February 2006, 23:12   #19
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You mean Audacity?
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Old 14th February 2006, 23:24   #20
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Audacity has been working fine, but is very slow. I'm referring to dBpowerAMP causing the codec error. I checked to make sure I pointed to lame.exe in that CLI thing, but it keeps saying that there was a codec error. Oddly enough, that's the codec I pointed to in Audacity and it works just fine and plays just fine.

Here's a screenshot

Note the huge 230,321 KB file sizes of the several WAV files. Note the MP3 files above. I converted the related WAVs to MP3's through Audacity all at 16 Kbps. I'm showing the settings I have here in dBpowerAMP if that helps.

void BlueWater() {water.color=blue; while(GameRunning) {if (fox.pos == InBlueWater) {fox.air--; FoxDrown(fox.air);} else {fox.air=1800; fox.flags = WantsToGetWet; } WaitFrames(1); }} // My top favorite thing in 2D Sonic (as C)
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