Yay, now I get to post my own computer thread...

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 17th July 2005, 00:04

Ok, I wasn't originally going to post this, but I had a question that didn't turn up any search results that were newer than about two years. So, instead of making a thread about one question, I figured I'd just talk about the new computer I'll be getting soon.

My question is: What's RAM timing? When I'm looking through NewEgg's RAM section, I see a bunch of them have timing ratings...

'Timing: 2-3-2-5'
'Timing: 2.5-6-3-3'
'Timing: 2-3-2'
'Timing: 2.5-4-4-8'
etc...

What's that mean? I'm probably sounding n00bish, but I have nfi what that's all about.

Now, on to what I'm thinking about getting.

I'm still undecided as to whether I want to buy a prebuilt computer or build my own. Both have their advantages and disadvantages. Some of the major advantages of a prebuilt that appeal to me are:

Price - Building a computer with comparable specs will end up costing a little more. Not much, but it will cost more.

OS - With a prebuilt, I won't have to "acquire" an OS to install since it'll already have one preinstalled.

Financing - I can finance a prebuilt computer. I don't really have credit to speak of, so this will help me establish it. Can't do that with home-built computers.

The great thing about building a computer is that I can get the parts that I want without having a bunch of extra crap along with it; like those all-in-one media card readers. The prebuilt computer I'm looking at has one of those 9-in-1 card readers, and I don't need it. It also doesn't have a regular, good old fashioned 3.5" floppy drive, which is something I would definitely put into a computer if I were building it. So I'm still kind of undecided as to whether I should buy one or build one.

Anyways, the prebuilt that I'm looking at is an HP Pavilion a1130n. Circuit City, Best Buy, and Comp-USA have them in stock.

All of my previous computers have all had Intel processors in them... I've had a Packard Bell Legend 232 with a 33mhz Intel 486sx, a Packard Bell PB2100 with a 233mhz Intel Pentium, a Hewlett-Packard Pavilion 6735 with a 633mhz Intel Celeron, and my current computer is a Hewlett-Packard Pavilion 504n with a 2ghz Intel Celeron II. They've all worked pretty well when they were newish, but after time, programs pass up the processors. My 2ghz Celeron just can't handle programs like it could a year and a half ago, no matter how well I keep my hard drive defragged and spyware/virus-free. So I think I'm going to get an AMD processor this time...

The HP Pavilion a1130n comes with an AMD Athlon 64 3500+ processor. But I've got a couple questions about that as well: What core does it have? Is it the Venice, Winchester, or Clawhammer? What's the process type; 90nm or 0.13 µm? I believe that the bus is integrated into the chip and runs at 2ghz, but I'm not positive about that. What are the differences between the different Athlon 64 3500+'s performance-wise?

Aside from it being 64-bit capable, it's got some other features that I like. It's got a PCI-E x16 slot for video, which is major ++. I kinda wish it had a couple PCI-E x1 and PCI-E x4 slots, but it's only got three legacy PCI slots other than the video slot. It's got a DVD-RW combo drive with LightScribe (pretty cool), and another DVD-ROM drive. It's got a 9-in-1 media card reader, but no floppy drive (I can probably put one in later if I end up buying it). And it's got four 184-pin RAM slots (comes with 2 x 512mb PC3200 400mhz RAM cards, but expandable to 4gb).

Also, I'm curious about SATA vs PATA. This Pavilion has a 250gb SATA hard drive. Other than it having a different kind of bus, I don't really know what the differences are. I've seen a couple different kinds of SATA (SATA 150 and SATA II). I assume that SATA 150 means that it's got a bandwidth of 150mbps, but what's SATA II? How can I tell which kind this Pavilion has in it?

If I get this Pavilion, I'll probably end up getting a new monitor, video card, and sound card as well. Any suggestions? As for video cards, I'd prefer something ATI, but it's not mandatory or anything. As for sound cards, I'd prefer something along the lines of a Creative Audigy 2 ZS or the like, but am open for alternatives. As for monitors, I definitely want something that's 19" or higher with a dpi of 0.26 or less, and is CRT. LCDs are still way too expensive, and they don't usually have dpi ratings as good as CRTs yet. I'd also prefer one that can handle up to 1600x1200 max pixel resolution, but will be happy with 1280x1024. I've been searching quite a bit, but if anyone's got some suggestions, I'll definitely listen.

beanboy89 · 17th July 2005, 00:49

We just ordered a new HP Pavillion a1050y on Wednesday. I don't know many of the technical details, but heres what I do know about it. It does have a Penmtium 4 3.0 GHz. We were debating between an AMD 64 or the P4, but chose the P4 because it was somewhat less expensive. We got 512 MB DDR RAM. Had the option of 256 MB, but in the long run, 512 MB would probably pay in the long run as newer applications come out. That was a mistake we made with out current computer, another HP Pavillion which we bought in 2000. We went for a low-end system and now it crawls along.

As far as a hard drive, we only went for a 160 GB SATA at 7200 RPM. It will proabably never get full with it being that big, though. It has a 16x DVD+/-RW and a 48x CD drive. Some Intel integrated graphics card, not worried about that, as I'm not a big gamer.

We custom ordered the PC, and it should be bult by July 26. Also, we ordered a 17" HP LCD monitor, and some all-in-one printer. They were delivered today. We connected up the LCD to our old comouter, and it's a nice monitor. I think the native resoultion is 1280x1024, but were currently running it at 1024x768. A big difference after you've been stareing at a 15" CRT at 800x600 for the past eight years.

Best of luck ordering your PC, Sarge.

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 17th July 2005, 01:09

Thanks.

And I'd just finished browsing through NewEgg checking the prices on some things...

If I were to build a computer that's comparable to that Pavilion a1130n, this is what I'd end up getting:

Motherboard
Processor
RAM
Hard Drive
DVD Burner
DVD Drive
Media Card Reader
Video Card
Case

It's not tit-for-tat comparable to the HP, but that's as close as I could get it. All these parts would add up to $1047. Now, I know that a big chunk of that is the video card, but seeing as how this motherboard doesn't have integrated video support, I'd have to add a video card. If I get the HP, I'll probably end up getting a video card for it, and that'll make the price difference quite a bit smaller... but even then, the HP still has Windows already installed. I'd have to 'buy' Windows to install on the home-built computer. Oh well.

Cheezychops · 17th July 2005, 01:41

I just got this set up. It was very easy to set up compaired to the last computer I built. The main reason it was better was because of the case. The case was built so you can take the motherboard plus all the cards out of the case. It is by far the best case I have ever come across. (I will post some pics later).

172.00 - MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum SLI Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 SLI ATX AMD Motherboard

372.00 - AMD Athlon 64 3800+ Venice Integrated into Chip FSB 512KB L2 Cache Socket 939 Processor

160.00 = 80.00 x 2 (Price may change, was on one day sale on newegg.com) CORSAIR ValueSelect 1GB 184-Pin DDR SDRAM Unbuffered DDR 400 (PC 3200) System Memory

295.00 - ATI 100-435500 Radeon X800XL 256MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card

47.00 - LITE-ON Black 16X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 4X DVD+R DL 16X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 24X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM 2M Cache IDE DVD Burner

23.00 - LITE-ON Black 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-ROM IDE DVD-ROM Drive Model SOHD-16P9SBLK

10.00 - SONY Black 1.44MB 3.5" Internal Floppy Drive Model MPF920 Black

177.00 - Lian Li PC-6070BPLUS Black Aluminum ATX Mid Tower Computer Case

89.00 - Antec TRUEPOWERII TPII-550 ATX12V 550W Power Supply 115/230 V UL, TUV, CB, FCC CLASS B, CUL
____________________________________________________
1345 + Shipping

I actually had to buy the case for xoxide.com because new egg didn't have it in stock. And I didnt get the plus i got the http://www.xoxide.com/pc6070b.html
I just realized i think i ordered the wrong case. Oh well it still worked niceley. I dont think the plus version would have fit on my desk.

Cheezychops · 17th July 2005, 02:04

I put this in a separte post to separate it from my other post to make more sense.

Your stuff:

Mobo: Looks good. Never used that brand before, but i am a MSI because of the easy setup.

Processor: Get retail. It comes with a heat sink and fan that work well, else you will have to buy one. I know in the retail version it said the warrenty was void if you didnt use the stock heat fan. Also the AMD64 versions do not get as hot as the AMD XPs do (at least it doesnt seem to from what i have experienced so far).

Ram: 512MB of ram is nothing these days. You will want at least a gig of ram, imo.

HDD: Never had any problems with WD

DVD Burner: Get the cheaper one in my post above

DVD Drive: Looks good.

media card reader: i have no experience with that

video card: 2 thumbs up, i like mine.

Case: you need a bigger power supply. a 350w will choke a AMD64. Get at least a 400W power supply. (or a 550W like in my post above, it is very nice)

k_rock923 · 17th July 2005, 03:33

Sarge, you may need registered/ECC ram with an AMD64

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 17th July 2005, 06:50

Quote:

Cheezychops said
172.00 - MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum SLI Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 SLI ATX AMD Motherboard

I LIKE that.

Quote:

372.00 - AMD Athlon 64 3800+ Venice Integrated into Chip FSB 512KB L2 Cache Socket 939 Processor

I'd love to get that, but that processor alone costs more than half of what that entire HP Pavilion costs.

Quote:

Processor: Get retail. It comes with a heat sink and fan that work well, else you will have to buy one. I know in the retail version it said the warrenty was void if you didnt use the stock heat fan. Also the AMD64 versions do not get as hot as the AMD XPs do (at least it doesnt seem to from what i have experienced so far).

That's another thing I forgot... a heatsink and fan. I can easily get one, but that's even more on the total cost.

Quote:

Ram: 512MB of ram is nothing these days. You will want at least a gig of ram, imo.

Oops. I posted the wrong RAM. The Pavilion comes with 1gb of RAM (2 x 512mb, not 2 x 256mb like I posted). And that'd be more again on the total cost.

Quote:

Case: you need a bigger power supply. a 350w will choke a AMD64. Get at least a 400W power supply. (or a 550W like in my post above, it is very nice)

I was thinking about that, but I wasn't sure how big the psu in that Pavilion is. I wasn't sure, so I estimated it at 350w. I'd definitely follow your suggestion, though.

Quote:

k_rock said
Sarge, you may need registered/ECC ram with an AMD64

That's another thing I have no clue about. What's the difference between registered and unregistered RAM. Buffered and unbuffered? What do the latency ratings mean? I still feel like such a n00b.

Cheezychops · 17th July 2005, 17:19

Quote:

Originally posted by sgtfuzzbubble99

1. I LIKE that.

2. I'd love to get that, but that processor alone costs more than half of what that entire HP Pavilion costs.

3. That's another thing I forgot... a heatsink and fan. I can easily get one, but that's even more on the total cost.

4. Oops. I posted the wrong RAM. The Pavilion comes with 1gb of RAM (2 x 512mb, not 2 x 256mb like I posted). And that'd be more again on the total cost.

5. I was thinking about that, but I wasn't sure how big the psu in that Pavilion is. I wasn't sure, so I estimated it at 350w. I'd definitely follow your suggestion, though.

6. That's another thing I have no clue about. What's the difference between registered and unregistered RAM. Buffered and unbuffered? What do the latency ratings mean? I still feel like such a n00b.

1. Yeah, MSI makes a good motherboard. It doesn't do as well in benchmark testing as other mobos but the MSI boards are so damn easy to set up. All I did to set mine up was hit the auto-set-up (it has a different name in the bios, i cant remember what it is) and i was done (after i double checked the settings).
If you are looking for a little bit cheaper board you could always go with this
The SLI (nvidia's dual card thing) is useless when you get an ATI video card. But I am not going to waste money on 2 video cards when all i need is one. (I heard SLI is all hype/marketing gimick anyways.) (BTW I can run DOOM3 in ultra high setting on that ATI 800XL with no lag. It is awsome.)

2. Yeah, the 3800+ is the highest processor you can get without going dual core. Dual core is up in the 500 dollar range and i wasnt going to pay 500 dollars for a processor. Thats why I went with the 3800+.
But you should really got retail when buying the processor. It is a little more for the 3500+ retail, but you get the heat sink and fan with it, plus a 3 year warrenty. (Retail for the 3800+ is actually cheaper than OEM

How did that happen?)

3. See above. It comes with a decent heat sink and fan. It's not a copper heat sink but it does the job well. Like i said before the 64 bit AMDs dont get as hot as the old AMD XPs did.

4. 1 gig is a good place to start out with. You can always upgrade later.

5. Yup, get at least a 400W power supply.

6. Not sure on this but i got unbuffered, no EEC ram and everything is working fine.
The lower the Latency the better. For example (2) low latency 512 MB sticks of ram will work faster than (1) 1 gig stick of low latency ram for games. (At least I think that is how it works)

Cheezychops · 17th July 2005, 19:08

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 17th July 2005, 19:09

I've heard lots of good things about MSI boards. If I do end up building a computer, I'll definitely look into them better. Oh, and I like how that MSI board has a "Creative sound Bluster Live" audio chipset.

But yeah, I have no need for SLI. As cool as it would be to run two video cards, I can't justify the price.

And I was also wondering if that HP Pavilion is capable of handling the 3800+ processor. I would assume it can because it's a socket 939 just like the processor that it's already got, and it's got the same bus speed. If I really wanted to have a 3800+, I could probably just get that Pavilion and then upgrade the processor later. I don't have any need right now for a dual core processor, so that'd be plenty fast enough to last me for quite some time. That, and I can still upgrade the RAM to 4gb, and it's compatible with PCI-E x16 video cards, I could turn that Pavilion into a powerhouse without spending a fortune. I could even buy a different case to transplant the parts into if I want.

[edit]
That looks badass, Cheezy.

[/edit]

Cheezychops · 17th July 2005, 19:20

Quote:

Originally posted by sgtfuzzbubble99
I've heard lots of good things about MSI boards. If I do end up building a computer, I'll definitely look into them better. Oh, and I like how that MSI board has a "Creative sound Bluster Live" audio chipset. But yeah, I have no need for SLI. As cool as it would be to run two video cards, I can't justify the price.

And I was also wondering if that HP Pavilion is capable of handling the 3800+ processor. I would assume it can because it's a socket 939 just like the processor that it's already got, and it's got the same bus speed. If I really wanted to have a 3800+, I could probably just get that Pavilion and then upgrade the processor later. I don't have any need right now for a dual core processor, so that'd be plenty fast enough to last me for quite some time. That, and I can still upgrade the RAM to 4gb, and it's compatible with PCI-E x16 video cards, I could turn that Pavilion into a powerhouse without spending a fortune. I could even buy a different case to transplant the parts into if I want.

[edit]
That looks badass, Cheezy.
[/edit]

(The blue computer is my old computer)

Any, yes you can go from a 3500+ to a 3800+ later, or even dual core once the prices go down.

The only reason I dont like to go prebuilt is because they never spec out what kind of Motherboard/Ram they put in these computers. They can put in all the good stuff (AMD 64, ATI 800XL, ect.) and then put in a motherboard/ram that totally cripples the quality of the other parts. Plus onboard video cards are always crap.

kingo'mountain · 17th July 2005, 19:49

sarge.... i have one point for you to consider when buying a prebuilt rig:

DO NOT trust all technicians who build computers for you, no matter how much papers and vibe they have, always reserch for happy costumers before you decide who builds your machine

Cheezychops · 17th July 2005, 20:05

I think you would be much happier with this setup:

Motherboard
Processor
Ram
Video Card
CD/DVD Burner
Dvd Drive
Power Supply
Case
Card Reader Thing
Floppy Drive
Hard Drive

Total: $1006.45 + shipping
$985.46 without that card reader.

And i think it will give you a lot better performance than the HP computer. I dont know of the quallity/performance of that video card but it has to be better than an on-board video card.
You could go with a cheaper case too, but Lian Li makes a very nice case.

[edit] Had the wrong type of ram linked before. [/edit]

Myxomatosis · 17th July 2005, 20:08

Quote:

Originally posted by k_rock923
Sarge, you may need registered/ECC ram with an AMD64

No, you only need registered/ECC RAM for server processors.

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 17th July 2005, 22:28

Quote:

Any, yes you can go from a 3500+ to a 3800+ later, or even dual core once the prices go down.

Schweet.

Quote:

The only reason I dont like to go prebuilt is because they never spec out what kind of Motherboard/Ram they put in these computers. They can put in all the good stuff (AMD 64, ATI 800XL, ect.) and then put in a motherboard/ram that totally cripples the quality of the other parts. Plus onboard video cards are always crap.

If I do get that Pavilion, I'll definitely get an ATI PCI-E x16 video card for it as well. Probably one with 256mb of RAM, but that'd be a little later on. And from what I've seen about the features on the motherboard that it's got, it has most of everything I want. Only other things it doesn't have that I might want are PCI-E x1 and x4 slots, and maybe SATA II support (it's got SATA 150, I think). But those aren't a big deal.

Quote:

DO NOT trust all technicians who build computers for you, no matter how much papers and vibe they have, always reserch for happy costumers before you decide who builds your machine

The reason I'm looking at this Pavilion is because I have personal experience with HP. My last two computers are/were HP Pavilions. Aside from stability issues (was running Win98se) with my last computer, I didn't have any real problems with it. I can't think of any major problems that I've had with my current computer, either. It's just slow (running a Celeron). The actual hardware quality of both of them was/is pretty good. And I'm actually quite pleased with my current computer, too.

Quote:

I think you would be much happier with this setup:

Motherboard
Processor
Ram
Video Card
CD/DVD Burner
Dvd Drive
Power Supply
Case
Card Reader Thing
Floppy Drive
Hard Drive

Total: $1006.45 + shipping
$985.46 without that card reader.

And i think it will give you a lot better performance than the HP computer. I dont know of the quallity/performance of that video card but it has to be better than an on-board video card.
You could go with a cheaper case too, but Lian Li makes a very nice case.

Only a couple things with those parts that I'm not keen on... The processor has a 1ghz bus. If I remember right, the other one has the bus integrated and is running at 2ghz. Even though the core clock speed on those 3500s are the same, the bus is twice as fast with the one that's integrated. Speed is good.

The ATI card looks good, but I might decide on one with 256mb of RAM. And if I get a floppy drive for my computer, it won't be a Sony. Sorry, but I don't like Sony.

Other than those things, everything else looks good.

And I went down to Circuit City a little bit ago to check it out some more. That HP looks really really tempting simply because of the option of financing.

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 18th July 2005, 02:30

So far, I've found several monitors that look pretty good. These two are on Fry's Outpost website:

Daewoo C925DBK 19" CRT
Envision EFT-920 19" CRT

And these four are on NewEgg's website:

CTX EX951FB-1 Black 19" CRT
SCANPORT GM-1995 Beige 19" CRT
ViewSonic E90FB Black 19" CRT
SAMSUNG 990DF-Black 19" CRT

All are 19" CRT monitors with 18" viewable screen area, dpi ratings of no more than 0.25mm, and are capable of at least 1600x1200 maximum pixel resolution. I'm still debating on which would be the best deal out of the six, and I'm also still open for suggestions.

shakey_snake · 18th July 2005, 02:41

I'd highly recommend getting one of the flat-screen CRT's.
ViewSonics are a great buy.

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 18th July 2005, 03:19

I just hope that the guy who wrote the last review on that ViewSonic got a lemon. If all of their monitors do that, I don't think I'd want one.

True flat isn't as important to me as a good quality image. The CTX and Samsung are looking pretty good because of the low dpi ratings, especially the Samsung. They're also a little bit less expensive than the ViewSonic as well. Now, if I could find a ViewSonic just like this one, except without the PerfectFlat, then that might sell me on it. Also, I like the black cases. Black would go so much better with the rest of my electronics than beige would.

shakey_snake · 18th July 2005, 03:29

Well, I've had my PerfectFlat for 2 years, and it's always been great.
I don't think "Kyle" knows what the pincushion setting does.

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 18th July 2005, 03:35

Ah, maybe that's it.

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 18th July 2005, 04:52

I think I found a good video card and sound card as well...

GIGABYTE Radeon X800 256MB
CREATIVE Sound Blaster Audigy2 ZS

That Radeon card really caught my eye since it doesn't have a cooling fan. Instead it uses dual heatsinks with heat transfer rods. The price is pretty decent, too.

The Audigy2 ZS looks like a great deal. I've got an Audigy2 in my current computer, and I love it, so I think that the ZS would be a natural upgrade... especially since it costs about half of what I paid for my Audigy2 when I bought it new. I was thinking about the Audigy2 ZS Gamer Edition, but I can't justify the extra price just for some bundled games. Still a great card, though.

Good deals? Suggestions?

Myxomatosis · 18th July 2005, 05:25

I would reccomend this case:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811129127
400 reviews with 4/5 is quite good. I have a cheaper Antec case. It's loaded with great features like rubberpads that the HDD's sit on to stop vibration noise and clips on optical drives(no screws).

Lian Li's have great cooling and layout, but I just wouldn't see myself buying a $170 case.

Quote:

Originally posted by Cheezychops

Case: you need a bigger power supply. a 350w will choke a AMD64. Get at least a 400W power supply. (or a 550W like in my post above, it is very nice)

I've found this site quite accurate in finding what powersupply you should get.
http://www.jscustompcs.com/power_supply/

BMWboy · 18th July 2005, 06:14

Quote:

Originally posted by sgtfuzzbubble99
I think I found a good video card and sound card as well...

GIGABYTE Radeon X800 256MB
CREATIVE Sound Blaster Audigy2 ZS

That Radeon card really caught my eye since it doesn't have a cooling fan. Instead it uses dual heatsinks with heat transfer rods. The price is pretty decent, too.

The Audigy2 ZS looks like a great deal. I've got an Audigy2 in my current computer, and I love it, so I think that the ZS would be a natural upgrade... especially since it costs about half of what I paid for my Audigy2 when I bought it new. I was thinking about the Audigy2 ZS Gamer Edition, but I can't justify the extra price just for some bundled games. Still a great card, though.

Good deals? Suggestions?

creative sells their overstock sound cards on ebay, i just picked up an audigy2 platnium Ex for about $94 off list price, the only downside is it only comes with a 30-day warrenty, and its only returnable if it is broken, just make sure you read the auction carefully, they sell their remanufactured cards on ebay too

mark · 18th July 2005, 15:01

Quote:

Originally posted by sgtfuzzbubble99
CTX EX951FB-1 Black 19" CRT

I have a 19" CTX (may be a different model, mines got a beige case...)

Cheap: yes
Shit: also yes.

mark · 18th July 2005, 15:03

audigys are bad news.

shakey_snake · 18th July 2005, 16:44

not once you get the Kx drivers...

mark · 18th July 2005, 17:23

I got the Kx drivers. Hella confusing. I never managed to get line-in and mic-in to be set up correctly at the same time. (i dont know if thats because you cant actually use both symoutaneously, but i dont want to, i just want to be able to talk to people, THEN watch some goddamn TV on my PCI tuner card.)

tuckerm · 18th July 2005, 17:46

hey sarge im using a pavilion and i love it..its perfect..i pefer HP over dell

mark · 18th July 2005, 19:06

I prefer death over dell.

xzxzzx · 18th July 2005, 19:09

As for the timings, do a search for "CAS timing" and you'll get a bunch of results. Here's a nice (though highly technical) article.

mark · 18th July 2005, 21:21

also, sata is faster than pata, and sata II is a faster form of sata

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 19th July 2005, 01:08

Quote:

I would reccomend this case:
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Produc...82E16811129127
400 reviews with 4/5 is quite good. I have a cheaper Antec case. It's loaded with great features like rubberpads that the HDD's sit on to stop vibration noise and clips on optical drives(no screws).

Lian Li's have great cooling and layout, but I just wouldn't see myself buying a $170 case.

I had to transplant a computer for a friend last year. Had to pull the guts out of the old case and put it in a new case... and the new case was an Antec very similar to this one. I was actually quite impressed with the quality. If I do end up getting a different case for the internals, Antec will be at the top of the list.

Quote:

creative sells their overstock sound cards on ebay, i just picked up an audigy2 platnium Ex for about $94 off list price, the only downside is it only comes with a 30-day warrenty, and its only returnable if it is broken, just make sure you read the auction carefully, they sell their remanufactured cards on ebay too

I might look into eBay, but I'm not going to count on it. So far, I've had great dealings with NewEgg, and they'll probably be my first choice when buying. And with eBay, I'd have to search through countless separate auctions to try to find the card I'm looking for. I like being able to just go straight to that card on NewEgg.

Quote:

I have a 19" CTX (may be a different model, mines got a beige case...)

Cheap: yes
Shit: also yes.

The main reason why I included the CTX is because my current monitor is a 17" CTX. It's been working quite well since I got it, but it's just a bit too small these days. Of course, that Samsung is still looking really tempting.

Quote:

audigys are bad news.

Well, I rather like the Audigy2 in my current computer. Got any suggestions for soundcards other than that?

Quote:

hey sarge im using a pavilion and i love it..its perfect..i pefer HP over dell

That was your computer that you had to move downstairs because of the heat, right?

My current Pavilion has the same exact case as that (same model, maybe?). Mines a 504n. I've seen a few Dell computers, and I'm not impressed at all with them. Dell wasn't even a consideration when I started this thread.

Quote:

As for the timings, do a search for "CAS timing" and you'll get a bunch of results. Here's a nice (though highly technical) article.

Ty. *goes to read*

[edit]
*head explodes*
[/edit]

Quote:

also, sata is faster than pata, and sata II is a faster form of sata

If I remember right, basic SATA (SATA 150) runs at 150mbps, and SATA II runs at twice that. Did I get that right? And don't they make IDE devices that can run at 150mbps now, too?

sgtfuzzbubble011 · 19th July 2005, 01:46

Oh, and I checked this out...

Quote:

I've found this site quite accurate in finding what powersupply you should get.
http://www.jscustompcs.com/power_supply/

Says I'll peak at 396 watts.

EfaustuS9 · 19th July 2005, 06:43

Quote:

Originally posted by Cheezychops
Yeah, the 3800+ is the highest processor you can get without going dual core.

actually the highest/fastest single core CPU's AMD makes are as follows

First and formost: AMD FX57.. the CPU itself costs as much as a decent midrange computer

.

http://www.newegg.com/product/Produc...l+ADAFX57BNBOX

or the more moderatly priced AMD64 4000+

http://www.newegg.com/product/Produc...l+ADA4000ASBOX

and of course some benchmarks to put the chips in perspective

Gaming:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=2456&p=6

Encoding:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=2456&p=5

Picture Editing:
http://www.anandtech.com/cpuchipsets...spx?i=2456&p=4

mark · 19th July 2005, 14:30

Quote:

Originally posted by Myxomatosis
I've found this site quite accurate in finding what powersupply you should get.
http://www.jscustompcs.com/power_supply/

I'm running my system off a cheap 350watt supply, and the site say i draw 290 or so. seems accurate to me. *bookmarks*

protegechris · 19th July 2005, 14:38

I just couldn't see paying 1000 dollars for a computer. Of course all i do is light gaming and video/audio editing, but damn man.

I wouldn't buy an hp pavilion. They have great support but crappy warranty and everyone on the phone is foreign.

Honestly if you shop around you can probably get off with building your own for quite cheap.. I'm looking for something like this: http://www.blucollarsales.com/catalo...roducts_id=264

Of course with a better psu and more max ram, I'm not really a fan of minitowers either though.

tuckerm · 19th July 2005, 14:48

Quote:

Originally posted by protegechris
I wouldn't buy an hp pavilion. They have great support but crappy warranty and everyone on the phone is foreign....

but ive never had to call support sure it overheats alot but thats what you get for a 1998 built computer

mark · 19th July 2005, 15:01

mystuff, ever cleaned out the heatsinks and fans?

protegechris · 19th July 2005, 15:01

I had a Pavilion 7125 ( 133 or 266 MHZ, 811 MB hd, 32mb RAM) a few years ago, one PCI slot worked, and everytime you restarted you had to reinstall all drivers and the ethernet card. It didn't have an overheating problem though

After that I got a HP pavilion 513x, 1.47ghz amd athlon 1700, 256mb ram, 32mb video onboard, 40gb hdd. Worked for a month or two, then the PSU took out when it was 1 year old, then the processor fan, followed by the hard drive. I have replaced all of that and it is running again now, it actually runs cooler than my computer.

Of course those computers weren't purchased new, they were used, but in good condition or I wouldn't have purchased them.

I wouldn't turn down an HP, but until I have another that is actually reliable I wouldn't buy one new. I have an HP digital camera (m305), took 3 trips to the store until I got one that wouldn't say the batteries were drained

I just haven't had good luck with them.

My aunt has a compaq and I have a compaq 700mhz 256mb ram, and I can get around 100 days uptime with my 700mhz while it runs my radio station. So my experience with their compaq branded products is good, I may be just on a bad luck spree with HP products

edit: mark, I think he cleans it out regularly, at least I believe he mentioned it in another thread..

tuckerm · 19th July 2005, 15:33

yes i clean it regular..once a month

17th July 2005, 00:04	#1
sgtfuzzbubble011 Join Date: Jun 2000 Posts: 60,842	Yay, now I get to post my own computer thread... Ok, I wasn't originally going to post this, but I had a question that didn't turn up any search results that were newer than about two years. So, instead of making a thread about one question, I figured I'd just talk about the new computer I'll be getting soon. My question is: What's RAM timing? When I'm looking through NewEgg's RAM section, I see a bunch of them have timing ratings... 'Timing: 2-3-2-5' 'Timing: 2.5-6-3-3' 'Timing: 2-3-2' 'Timing: 2.5-4-4-8' etc... What's that mean? I'm probably sounding n00bish, but I have nfi what that's all about. Now, on to what I'm thinking about getting. I'm still undecided as to whether I want to buy a prebuilt computer or build my own. Both have their advantages and disadvantages. Some of the major advantages of a prebuilt that appeal to me are: Price - Building a computer with comparable specs will end up costing a little more. Not much, but it will cost more. OS - With a prebuilt, I won't have to "acquire" an OS to install since it'll already have one preinstalled. Financing - I can finance a prebuilt computer. I don't really have credit to speak of, so this will help me establish it. Can't do that with home-built computers. The great thing about building a computer is that I can get the parts that I want without having a bunch of extra crap along with it; like those all-in-one media card readers. The prebuilt computer I'm looking at has one of those 9-in-1 card readers, and I don't need it. It also doesn't have a regular, good old fashioned 3.5" floppy drive, which is something I would definitely put into a computer if I were building it. So I'm still kind of undecided as to whether I should buy one or build one. Anyways, the prebuilt that I'm looking at is an HP Pavilion a1130n. Circuit City, Best Buy, and Comp-USA have them in stock. All of my previous computers have all had Intel processors in them... I've had a Packard Bell Legend 232 with a 33mhz Intel 486sx, a Packard Bell PB2100 with a 233mhz Intel Pentium, a Hewlett-Packard Pavilion 6735 with a 633mhz Intel Celeron, and my current computer is a Hewlett-Packard Pavilion 504n with a 2ghz Intel Celeron II. They've all worked pretty well when they were newish, but after time, programs pass up the processors. My 2ghz Celeron just can't handle programs like it could a year and a half ago, no matter how well I keep my hard drive defragged and spyware/virus-free. So I think I'm going to get an AMD processor this time... The HP Pavilion a1130n comes with an AMD Athlon 64 3500+ processor. But I've got a couple questions about that as well: What core does it have? Is it the Venice, Winchester, or Clawhammer? What's the process type; 90nm or 0.13 µm? I believe that the bus is integrated into the chip and runs at 2ghz, but I'm not positive about that. What are the differences between the different Athlon 64 3500+'s performance-wise? Aside from it being 64-bit capable, it's got some other features that I like. It's got a PCI-E x16 slot for video, which is major ++. I kinda wish it had a couple PCI-E x1 and PCI-E x4 slots, but it's only got three legacy PCI slots other than the video slot. It's got a DVD-RW combo drive with LightScribe (pretty cool), and another DVD-ROM drive. It's got a 9-in-1 media card reader, but no floppy drive (I can probably put one in later if I end up buying it). And it's got four 184-pin RAM slots (comes with 2 x 512mb PC3200 400mhz RAM cards, but expandable to 4gb). Also, I'm curious about SATA vs PATA. This Pavilion has a 250gb SATA hard drive. Other than it having a different kind of bus, I don't really know what the differences are. I've seen a couple different kinds of SATA (SATA 150 and SATA II). I assume that SATA 150 means that it's got a bandwidth of 150mbps, but what's SATA II? How can I tell which kind this Pavilion has in it? If I get this Pavilion, I'll probably end up getting a new monitor, video card, and sound card as well. Any suggestions? As for video cards, I'd prefer something ATI, but it's not mandatory or anything. As for sound cards, I'd prefer something along the lines of a Creative Audigy 2 ZS or the like, but am open for alternatives. As for monitors, I definitely want something that's 19" or higher with a dpi of 0.26 or less, and is CRT. LCDs are still way too expensive, and they don't usually have dpi ratings as good as CRTs yet. I'd also prefer one that can handle up to 1600x1200 max pixel resolution, but will be happy with 1280x1024. I've been searching quite a bit, but if anyone's got some suggestions, I'll definitely listen.

17th July 2005, 00:49	#2
beanboy89 (Major Dude) isn't very custom Join Date: Nov 2003 Location: Pennsylvania, USA Posts: 2,004	We just ordered a new HP Pavillion a1050y on Wednesday. I don't know many of the technical details, but heres what I do know about it. It does have a Penmtium 4 3.0 GHz. We were debating between an AMD 64 or the P4, but chose the P4 because it was somewhat less expensive. We got 512 MB DDR RAM. Had the option of 256 MB, but in the long run, 512 MB would probably pay in the long run as newer applications come out. That was a mistake we made with out current computer, another HP Pavillion which we bought in 2000. We went for a low-end system and now it crawls along. As far as a hard drive, we only went for a 160 GB SATA at 7200 RPM. It will proabably never get full with it being that big, though. It has a 16x DVD+/-RW and a 48x CD drive. Some Intel integrated graphics card, not worried about that, as I'm not a big gamer. We custom ordered the PC, and it should be bult by July 26. Also, we ordered a 17" HP LCD monitor, and some all-in-one printer. They were delivered today. We connected up the LCD to our old comouter, and it's a nice monitor. I think the native resoultion is 1280x1024, but were currently running it at 1024x768. A big difference after you've been stareing at a 15" CRT at 800x600 for the past eight years. Best of luck ordering your PC, Sarge. Site \| Help us count

17th July 2005, 03:33	#6
k_rock923 \m/ (Forum King) Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: /bin/bash Posts: 7,850	Sarge, you may need registered/ECC ram with an AMD64 Never underestimate the bandwidth of a station wagon full of tapes hurtling down the highway.

17th July 2005, 20:05	#13
Cheezychops Major Dude Join Date: Dec 2000 Posts: 731	I think you would be much happier with this setup: Motherboard Processor Ram Video Card CD/DVD Burner Dvd Drive Power Supply Case Card Reader Thing Floppy Drive Hard Drive Total: $1006.45 + shipping $985.46 without that card reader. And i think it will give you a lot better performance than the HP computer. I dont know of the quallity/performance of that video card but it has to be better than an on-board video card. You could go with a cheaper case too, but Lian Li makes a very nice case. [edit] Had the wrong type of ram linked before. [/edit] Last edited by Cheezychops; 17th July 2005 at 20:36.

18th July 2005, 02:41	#17
shakey_snake Forum Domo Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Everyone, get over here for the picture! Posts: 4,313	I'd highly recommend getting one of the flat-screen CRT's. ViewSonics are a great buy. elevatorladyelevatorladyelevatorladyelevatorladyelevatorladylevitateme

17th July 2005, 01:09	#3
sgtfuzzbubble011 Join Date: Jun 2000 Posts: 60,842	Thanks. And I'd just finished browsing through NewEgg checking the prices on some things... If I were to build a computer that's comparable to that Pavilion a1130n, this is what I'd end up getting: Motherboard Processor RAM Hard Drive DVD Burner DVD Drive Media Card Reader Video Card Case It's not tit-for-tat comparable to the HP, but that's as close as I could get it. All these parts would add up to $1047. Now, I know that a big chunk of that is the video card, but seeing as how this motherboard doesn't have integrated video support, I'd have to add a video card. If I get the HP, I'll probably end up getting a video card for it, and that'll make the price difference quite a bit smaller... but even then, the HP still has Windows already installed. I'd have to 'buy' Windows to install on the home-built computer. Oh well.

17th July 2005, 01:41	#4
Cheezychops Major Dude Join Date: Dec 2000 Posts: 731	I just got this set up. It was very easy to set up compaired to the last computer I built. The main reason it was better was because of the case. The case was built so you can take the motherboard plus all the cards out of the case. It is by far the best case I have ever come across. (I will post some pics later). 172.00 - MSI K8N Neo4 Platinum SLI Socket 939 NVIDIA nForce4 SLI ATX AMD Motherboard 372.00 - AMD Athlon 64 3800+ Venice Integrated into Chip FSB 512KB L2 Cache Socket 939 Processor 160.00 = 80.00 x 2 (Price may change, was on one day sale on newegg.com) CORSAIR ValueSelect 1GB 184-Pin DDR SDRAM Unbuffered DDR 400 (PC 3200) System Memory 295.00 - ATI 100-435500 Radeon X800XL 256MB 256-bit GDDR3 PCI Express x16 Video Card 47.00 - LITE-ON Black 16X DVD+R 8X DVD+RW 4X DVD+R DL 16X DVD-R 6X DVD-RW 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-R 24X CD-RW 48X CD-ROM 2M Cache IDE DVD Burner 23.00 - LITE-ON Black 16X DVD-ROM 48X CD-ROM IDE DVD-ROM Drive Model SOHD-16P9SBLK 10.00 - SONY Black 1.44MB 3.5" Internal Floppy Drive Model MPF920 Black 177.00 - Lian Li PC-6070BPLUS Black Aluminum ATX Mid Tower Computer Case 89.00 - Antec TRUEPOWERII TPII-550 ATX12V 550W Power Supply 115/230 V UL, TUV, CB, FCC CLASS B, CUL ____________________________________________________ 1345 + Shipping I actually had to buy the case for xoxide.com because new egg didn't have it in stock. And I didnt get the plus i got the http://www.xoxide.com/pc6070b.html I just realized i think i ordered the wrong case. Oh well it still worked niceley. I dont think the plus version would have fit on my desk.

17th July 2005, 02:04	#5
Cheezychops Major Dude Join Date: Dec 2000 Posts: 731	I put this in a separte post to separate it from my other post to make more sense. Your stuff: Mobo: Looks good. Never used that brand before, but i am a MSI because of the easy setup. Processor: Get retail. It comes with a heat sink and fan that work well, else you will have to buy one. I know in the retail version it said the warrenty was void if you didnt use the stock heat fan. Also the AMD64 versions do not get as hot as the AMD XPs do (at least it doesnt seem to from what i have experienced so far). Ram: 512MB of ram is nothing these days. You will want at least a gig of ram, imo. HDD: Never had any problems with WD DVD Burner: Get the cheaper one in my post above DVD Drive: Looks good. media card reader: i have no experience with that video card: 2 thumbs up, i like mine. Case: you need a bigger power supply. a 350w will choke a AMD64. Get at least a 400W power supply. (or a 550W like in my post above, it is very nice)

17th July 2005, 19:08	#9
Cheezychops Major Dude Join Date: Dec 2000 Posts: 731	Here are the pics i took while building mine: http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/index....h=new_computer Individual links: http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer001.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer002.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer003.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer004.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer005.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer006.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer007.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer008.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer009.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer010.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer011.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer012.jpg http://cheezy.my1337.net/pics/new_co...omputer013.jpg

17th July 2005, 19:09	#10
sgtfuzzbubble011 Join Date: Jun 2000 Posts: 60,842	I've heard lots of good things about MSI boards. If I do end up building a computer, I'll definitely look into them better. Oh, and I like how that MSI board has a "Creative sound Bluster Live" audio chipset. But yeah, I have no need for SLI. As cool as it would be to run two video cards, I can't justify the price. And I was also wondering if that HP Pavilion is capable of handling the 3800+ processor. I would assume it can because it's a socket 939 just like the processor that it's already got, and it's got the same bus speed. If I really wanted to have a 3800+, I could probably just get that Pavilion and then upgrade the processor later. I don't have any need right now for a dual core processor, so that'd be plenty fast enough to last me for quite some time. That, and I can still upgrade the RAM to 4gb, and it's compatible with PCI-E x16 video cards, I could turn that Pavilion into a powerhouse without spending a fortune. I could even buy a different case to transplant the parts into if I want. [edit] That looks badass, Cheezy. [/edit]

17th July 2005, 19:49	#12
kingo'mountain in need of banned aid Join Date: Mar 2001 Location: over the rainb... uh... nevermind Posts: 2,716	sarge.... i have one point for you to consider when buying a prebuilt rig: DO NOT trust all technicians who build computers for you, no matter how much papers and vibe they have, always reserch for happy costumers before you decide who builds your machine

18th July 2005, 02:30	#16
sgtfuzzbubble011 Join Date: Jun 2000 Posts: 60,842	So far, I've found several monitors that look pretty good. These two are on Fry's Outpost website: Daewoo C925DBK 19" CRT Envision EFT-920 19" CRT And these four are on NewEgg's website: CTX EX951FB-1 Black 19" CRT SCANPORT GM-1995 Beige 19" CRT ViewSonic E90FB Black 19" CRT SAMSUNG 990DF-Black 19" CRT All are 19" CRT monitors with 18" viewable screen area, dpi ratings of no more than 0.25mm, and are capable of at least 1600x1200 maximum pixel resolution. I'm still debating on which would be the best deal out of the six, and I'm also still open for suggestions.

18th July 2005, 03:19	#18
sgtfuzzbubble011 Join Date: Jun 2000 Posts: 60,842	I just hope that the guy who wrote the last review on that ViewSonic got a lemon. If all of their monitors do that, I don't think I'd want one. True flat isn't as important to me as a good quality image. The CTX and Samsung are looking pretty good because of the low dpi ratings, especially the Samsung. They're also a little bit less expensive than the ViewSonic as well. Now, if I could find a ViewSonic just like this one, except without the PerfectFlat, then that might sell me on it. Also, I like the black cases. Black would go so much better with the rest of my electronics than beige would.

18th July 2005, 03:29	#19
shakey_snake Forum Domo Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Everyone, get over here for the picture! Posts: 4,313	Well, I've had my PerfectFlat for 2 years, and it's always been great. I don't think "Kyle" knows what the pincushion setting does. elevatorladyelevatorladyelevatorladyelevatorladyelevatorladylevitateme

18th July 2005, 03:35	#20
sgtfuzzbubble011 Join Date: Jun 2000 Posts: 60,842	Ah, maybe that's it.

18th July 2005, 04:52	#21
sgtfuzzbubble011 Join Date: Jun 2000 Posts: 60,842	I think I found a good video card and sound card as well... GIGABYTE Radeon X800 256MB CREATIVE Sound Blaster Audigy2 ZS That Radeon card really caught my eye since it doesn't have a cooling fan. Instead it uses dual heatsinks with heat transfer rods. The price is pretty decent, too. The Audigy2 ZS looks like a great deal. I've got an Audigy2 in my current computer, and I love it, so I think that the ZS would be a natural upgrade... especially since it costs about half of what I paid for my Audigy2 when I bought it new. I was thinking about the Audigy2 ZS Gamer Edition, but I can't justify the extra price just for some bundled games. Still a great card, though. Good deals? Suggestions?

18th July 2005, 15:03	#25
mark Forum King Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Norn Ir'nd, leek... Posts: 6,285	audigys are bad news.

18th July 2005, 16:44	#26
shakey_snake Forum Domo Join Date: Jan 2004 Location: Everyone, get over here for the picture! Posts: 4,313	not once you get the Kx drivers... elevatorladyelevatorladyelevatorladyelevatorladyelevatorladylevitateme

18th July 2005, 17:23	#27
mark Forum King Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Norn Ir'nd, leek... Posts: 6,285	I got the Kx drivers. Hella confusing. I never managed to get line-in and mic-in to be set up correctly at the same time. (i dont know if thats because you cant actually use both symoutaneously, but i dont want to, i just want to be able to talk to people, THEN watch some goddamn TV on my PCI tuner card.)

18th July 2005, 17:46	#28
tuckerm Forum Emo Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 8,365	hey sarge im using a pavilion and i love it..its perfect..i pefer HP over dell @tuckerm

18th July 2005, 19:06	#29
mark Forum King Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Norn Ir'nd, leek... Posts: 6,285	I prefer death over dell.

18th July 2005, 19:09	#30
xzxzzx Forum King Join Date: Aug 2002 Posts: 7,254	As for the timings, do a search for "CAS timing" and you'll get a bunch of results. Here's a nice (though highly technical) article. Freedom of speech is the basic freedom of humanity. When you've lost that, you've lost everything. 1\/\/4y 34\|<$p4y 1gp4y 33714y, 0d4y 0uy4y? \| Roses are #FF0000; Violets are #0000FF; chown -R ${YOU} ~/base The DMCA. It really is that bad. : Count for your life.

18th July 2005, 21:21	#31
mark Forum King Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Norn Ir'nd, leek... Posts: 6,285	also, sata is faster than pata, and sata II is a faster form of sata

19th July 2005, 14:38	#36
protegechris Forum Queen Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 6,635	I just couldn't see paying 1000 dollars for a computer. Of course all i do is light gaming and video/audio editing, but damn man. I wouldn't buy an hp pavilion. They have great support but crappy warranty and everyone on the phone is foreign. Honestly if you shop around you can probably get off with building your own for quite cheap.. I'm looking for something like this: http://www.blucollarsales.com/catalo...roducts_id=264 Of course with a better psu and more max ram, I'm not really a fan of minitowers either though. yeah, i'm back.

19th July 2005, 15:01	#38
mark Forum King Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Norn Ir'nd, leek... Posts: 6,285	mystuff, ever cleaned out the heatsinks and fans?

19th July 2005, 15:33	#40
tuckerm Forum Emo Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 8,365	yes i clean it regular..once a month @tuckerm

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