Old 5th June 2003, 18:25   #1
vboogieman
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BMI Threats

Has anyone ever had their site downed because of this?

(excerpt from BMI message)
BMI will be forced to consider whatever legal remedies it may have including, but not limited to, using the Notice and Take-Down
provisions of the Digital Millennium Copyright Act ("DMCA") by notifying your Internet Service Provider of potentially infringing activity on your web site and demanding that your web site is removed or disabled.
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Old 5th June 2003, 20:14   #2
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Care to elaborate on the "potentially infringing activity"?

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Old 5th June 2003, 20:27   #3
vboogieman
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activity

Having a site playing music over SHOUTcast.
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Old 5th June 2003, 21:21   #4
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as in illegal stations, i.e ones that are meant to be paying royalties and such but arn't???

or does this include anyone, whether they are legal or not?


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Old 5th June 2003, 21:33   #5
vboogieman
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OK maybe I should rephrase the question.

What are all the royalties that should be paid by a SHOUTcast station?
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Old 5th June 2003, 21:36   #6
matt2kjones
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uk people need to buy a license from www.prs.co.uk

dunno about anywhere else

But, your a host, u dont pay these, the broadcaster does, but make sure u state in your disclamer, or legal notes or whatever that they need to get legalised so that 'you' dont get the blame


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Old 5th June 2003, 21:50   #7
vboogieman
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I am not getting the messages for DNAS I am hosting... I am getting it about a website I run.
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Old 5th June 2003, 22:14   #8
jagwac
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Sound Exchange $2,000
ASCAP $265
BMI $265
SESAC $140
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Old 5th June 2003, 22:24   #9
vboogieman
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If someone wanted to host their site in a country where there were no laws like DMCA where would they do it?
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Old 5th June 2003, 22:28   #10
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Asia?

Still...it depends on where the stream originates from I think?
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Old 5th June 2003, 23:01   #11
DJ AmPs
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Quote:
Originally posted by vboogieman
If someone wanted to host their site in a country where there were no laws like DMCA where would they do it?
It really doesnt matter WHERE the stream originates physically. The BMI people don't know a damn thing about DNAS's or what IP stands for. They do a DNS lookup on the domain name and just form mail the owner, based on the address.

Just link to a shoutcast search where only your station shows up. They only trip over a tune in link -- let them bug shoutcast instead =)

Last edited by DJ AmPs; 6th June 2003 at 00:00.
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Old 5th June 2003, 23:11   #12
vboogieman
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How do I?

Just link to a shoutcast search where only your station shows up.
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Old 5th June 2003, 23:31   #13
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Yep. That would do it.
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Old 5th June 2003, 23:49   #14
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YUP!

Just do a "LISTEN HERE" or "Click Here To Listen"

<A HREF="http://www.shoutcast.com/directory/?s=BrainGell&numresult=25">Listen To My Station NOW</A>

JE

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Listen to Urban Hitz Radio - GET A Local or TOLL-FREE Request Line NOW...Only $2 Monthly
Request Line: 1-855 588-6767
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Old 6th June 2003, 17:21   #15
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Ok could somebody tell me what the heck is going on?? Totally confused on the subject! These people sent this guy a email telling him he wasn't compling with the law??

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Old 6th June 2003, 17:23   #16
vboogieman
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Yeah, they sent an email saying to contact them or they would contact the ISP and bring down the station site.
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Old 6th June 2003, 17:25   #17
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what losers!

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Old 6th June 2003, 17:25   #18
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I didnt realize shoutcast needed a liscence.
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Old 6th June 2003, 17:27   #19
vboogieman
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I realize that you need a license...

I just didn't think they could get your ISP to shutdown your site...
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Old 6th June 2003, 17:28   #20
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What kind of licesnce? Link?
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Old 6th June 2003, 17:29   #21
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I wish it was that way

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Old 8th June 2003, 01:50   #22
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I'd ignore the emails and see what happens. I think they're running off of a bluff, aka F.O.S.

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http://www.star104.net
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Old 8th June 2003, 04:46   #23
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artists should be paying us for all the damn work we do to get their music heard.
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Old 8th June 2003, 04:48   #24
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Thank u
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Old 8th June 2003, 09:51   #25
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just remove the listen link and they won't be able to persue it further, their policies on the internet lack general knowledge about the many different ways to transmit data, they only worry about sites that are linking to copyrighted content, removing the link is your only option outside of coughing up the bucks to pay for the contract.
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Old 8th June 2003, 22:09   #26
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I changed our listen link to point to a shoutcast search for our station.

Do you think that will be enough?
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Old 8th June 2003, 22:17   #27
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yea should

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Old 17th June 2003, 08:17   #28
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If the music is NOT BMI registered don't worry "mp3.com music is ok to use" Because they have no bmi broadcast register.

so bmi riaa can't do a damn thing 'told to me by a broadcast attorney.
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Old 17th June 2003, 10:44   #29
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yea u can use music off mp3.com but uu just cant download it and use it, you still have to contact each artist you download music from to make sure they allow you to use it

when a track isn't signed by a label, its copyrighted by the artist, and they have a say whether u can use it or not


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Old 17th June 2003, 16:21   #30
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Yes I know it's has composer rights, but come on "What mp3.com does not want air play?" lol when you ask them, their response by e mail enclude one or two tracks more lol
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Old 17th June 2003, 16:23   #31
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ain't that just great . Thats how music comunities should be

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Old 17th June 2003, 16:26   #32
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Still, permission is not implied.

Without express permission, you have none.

Here's what I use.
It might not be 100% legalese, but it's a "Good Faith" start.
Feel free to edit/modify/use.

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Old 17th June 2003, 16:30   #33
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Great Form.

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Old 20th June 2003, 18:13   #34
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What if I only play my own personal original music (and perhaps other peoples original music if they sign a statement for me not to ever require royalites or anything from me for playing their stuff) and talk? I dont need a licence then do I?
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Old 20th June 2003, 18:24   #35
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you do not need a license to play your own music, nor do u need a license to play artists music if they give u permission (as long as their music isn't signed by a label).

if an artists music is signed by a label the artist isn't the person that can give u the permission to use it or not

once an artist is signed, the music is distributed by that copyright. so all copyrighted music has to have the permission from the copyright label

all unsigned music needs permission off the artist.


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Old 20th June 2003, 22:18   #36
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they should pay us for playing there music.if you are making money from there music then u should pay.the artist love that we are still playing there one hit wonder.they make one good song it becomes a hit and then there gone.but we are still here playing there music
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Old 20th June 2003, 23:18   #37
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You have the greatest point. yet i disagree :$ lets just analyze for a moment
they should pay us: not really. I think it should be free (no royalties needed)

Then we should pay them if were a profit station: yes (at a reasonable rate)

More and more I start sounding like KXRM! :$ can't be good. Only dif would be that everybody must pay royalties!

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Old 8th January 2004, 00:32   #38
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vboogieman how did you make out with this issue? I just got the same letter.

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Old 8th January 2004, 00:43   #39
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If they threatened my station i would take them to court.

Heres why:

FM Radio pays 3% of their total revenue to the ARTISTS, not these "money grabbing loops" that they have forced the webcaster industry into.

If you are non-profit, 3% of $0.00 is $0.00

Also on FM radio, they PAY FM radio stations to play a song.

If we are being compared to FM Radio stations in the DMCA, then they cannot single us out to line their pockets. If there is a way to pay the artists directly i would, but i refuse to pay a record company whos losses came from 9/11 and they try and shroud the economic collapse to piracy.

I Make. Perform. Mix. Play. Music.
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Old 8th January 2004, 01:23   #40
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look at your cds

Quote:
Originally posted by JosyWales
What if I only play my own personal original music (and perhaps other peoples original music if they sign a statement for me not to ever require royalites or anything from me for playing their stuff) and talk? I dont need a licence then do I?
If you look at your "owned" music on the packaging, normally there is a copyright statement that also includes the text the reads something like "may not broadcast". Its kind of like an EULA (end user license agreement) for music. Albums since the early days of commercial music has carried that text.

The law requires you to pay royalties to any artist whos music you play that collects royalties. So if you are playing artists that belong to BMI, you need to pay BMI a standard royalty rate. If the artist belongs to ASCAP, which I belong to, then you need to pay ASCAP royalties.

BMI I suspect is simply going through the shoutcast directory and looking for stations who are playing music from artists that are members of BMI on a daily basis. Then they lookup who the owner of the ip address owner is of the broadcast and or website linking to the broadcast. Then they send out the default letter. They will probably follow up with you in a couple of weeks or so with an even harsher letter. Then after that they will probably start sending your host letters. This is all in an attempt to presure you to sign up to their program because you are broadcasting their artists without paying royalties.

You can always bluff them back and send off a quick reply that states "all BMI artists have been removed from the playlist rotations. If you see any artists we missed, please feel free to alert us so we can remove them promptly".

Then that makes them think you are in compliance. And when they check to see if you are in compliance, they will email you with the artists names who you are still broadcasting. Then remove those songs from your playlist and email them back saying they have been removed and thank them for noticing the problem.

Make them do that over and over and over and over and over and over

You keep telling them you are in compliance and they keep checking. Remove only what they ask you to remove. As long as you remove them when they ask you... you will be fine. Keep a record of all your email transactions just in case so you can illustrate that you have removed artists when asked. They cant do jack shit then.
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