Old 17th May 2004, 07:54   #1
KiwiPatriot2000
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Streamripping

is ths someone ripping my stream?

<05/17/04@03:56:08> [dest: 212.144.23.108] starting stream (UID: 6)[L: 1]{A: WinampMPEG/2.8 mp3PRO/1.2}(P: 0)
<05/17/04@03:56:16> [dest: 212.144.23.108] starting stream (UID: 7)[L: 2]{A: Streamripper/1.x}(P: 1)
<05/17/04@03:56:27> [dest: 212.144.23.108] connection closed (19 seconds) (UID: 6)[L: 1]{Bytes: 1146****(P: 0)
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Old 17th May 2004, 07:56   #2
Jay
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yes

this line indicates a streamripper:
<05/17/04@03:56:16> [dest: 212.144.23.108] starting stream (UID: 7)[L: 2]{A: Streamripper/1.x}(P: 1)
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Old 17th May 2004, 08:24   #3
KiwiPatriot2000
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Streamripping

thanks KXRM for the confirmation!
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Old 19th May 2004, 21:37   #4
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Tell me what is bad exactly for you as station owner when anybody ripping your station?

Many people record video from TV. And TV channels do not trying to stop it.

What's the matter?
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Old 19th May 2004, 21:49   #5
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theres a few things. it eats up the sttions slots and bandwidth. both tv and fm radio dont have to worry about that. as well, a few of the ig shoutcast stations have to py a few grand in royalties a month just to play licensed music. when they pay those royalties they basicaly agree to prevent any illegal copying of that music, which streamripping is.
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Old 20th May 2004, 01:11   #6
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WHAT I LOVE, is searching Google for my station name and getting hits at the StationRipper forums saying, "I'm trying to rip this stream, but I'm having problems. It's telling me it's not a SHOUTcast stream..."

LOL...either my streams are "protected" (from that one software at least), or my streams just dont' work...lol!

rg.
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Old 20th May 2004, 13:36   #7
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2Vchat20:
I am member of 3aLab Team and we create ripping software "(null)". Our software do not eat slots on stations. It seems for station like usual listener with usual player. Just save in mp3 in background. Do you allow use our software or you against?

2rgATL: Please, give me URLs with your streams.

P.S.:
Forbid it or allow it kind of rippers?
[removed references and url to streamripping software, read the rules of the forum please -KXRM]
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Old 20th May 2004, 13:42   #8
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thats exactly what i meant. it may not use more slots than a normal listener would, but its a waste of a slot. id rather have someone who's actually "listening" use that slot instead of some mindless ripping software.

im against all streamrippers btw. for the same statements i posted above.
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Old 20th May 2004, 14:00   #9
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Ok. Ripping software is just a mindless software.
But what for they ripping streams with audio? What for?
For listening it later.
For example you can't listen your favorite station right now and you need to go, but you can't miss it and record for yourself. You will listen it later, then delete.
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Old 20th May 2004, 14:14   #10
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If you want to listen later, just tune into the stream then. C'mon you are fooling nobody here. The purpose of stream ripping is to aquire music for free. Which is exactly what the RIAA and BMG don't want you to do. Listen to the streams...if you like the music, go to the store and buy it.

soulful1
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Old 20th May 2004, 14:48   #11
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Quote:
Originally posted by soulful1
If you want to listen later, just tune into the stream then. C'mon you are fooling nobody here. The purpose of stream ripping is to aquire music for free. Which is exactly what the RIAA and BMG don't want you to do. Listen to the streams...if you like the music, go to the store and buy it.

soulful1
If I like the music in good CD quality, then I go to the store and buy it. Sure, I am agree.

But stations cast maximum at 160 kbps.
CD quality means at least 320 kbps and more.

Every record from your stations is only "demo version" of this music. Good quality music everyones buying in store.
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Old 20th May 2004, 17:01   #12
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Quote:
Originally posted by onekit
If I like the music in good CD quality, then I go to the store and buy it. Sure, I am agree.

But stations cast maximum at 160 kbps.
CD quality means at least 320 kbps and more.

Every record from your stations is only "demo version" of this music. Good quality music everyones buying in store.
this does not justify streamripping. If you rip a very popular station and take slots away from active listeners then you need to be banned. That's that.
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Old 20th May 2004, 20:08   #13
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this person ripped about 9 hours of my programming - got suspicious 10 mins ago, i stopped the program, started it up again - and woolah!!!(i'm hoping this ip address was ripping)

************************************************************ SHOUTcast Distributed Network Audio Server
** Copyright (C) 1998-2004 Nullsoft, Inc. All Rights Reserved.
** Use "sc_serv filename.ini" to specify an ini file.
************************************************************
Event log:
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [SHOUTcast] DNAS/win32 v1.9.4 (Mar 17 2004) starting up...
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] loaded config from C:\Program Files\SHOUTcast\sc_serv.ini
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] initializing (usermax:5 portbase:8000)...
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] No ban file found (sc_serv.ban)
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] No rip file found (sc_serv.rip)
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] opening source socket
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] source thread starting
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] opening client socket
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] Client Stream thread [0] starting
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [main] client main thread starting
<05/23/04@16:10:25> [source] listening for connection on port 8001
<05/23/04@16:10:26> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting
<05/23/04@16:10:28> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting
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Old 20th May 2004, 20:32   #14
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Quote:
Originally posted by KXRM
this does not justify streamripping. If you rip a very popular station and take slots away from active listeners then you need to be banned. That's that.
You said "ACTIVE LISTENER". What different between ACTIVE LISTENER and LISTENER who save in mp3 simultaneously (at the same time)?
In these both cases we have only one connection. Only one busy slot.

Your ACTIVE LISTENER can be passive and going down to minimal sound volume (you don't know), but user with ripper can listen radio and at the same time save to mp3. And this user can be really big lover of your station. He love your station, that because he save it to mp3.


P.S.: Sorry for software names and titles. I do not obtain goal get advertise here. I just want to know why ripping software do not like station-owners.
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Old 20th May 2004, 20:37   #15
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well now you know why, we hate ripping software, and most of it is not active at all, just some program setup to archive the stream. Now the only time I would agree with you is if a person runs a talk show or other original programming, but any music station that get's ripped is being ripped for the pure purpose of having the music to trade on p2p, or to skip having to buy the Music legitamately. Personally I no longer care, I have setup my station specifically with the idea that you aren't going to rip it without getting garbage in your saves.
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Old 20th May 2004, 21:06   #16
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2KXRM:

Thank you.

As you see, comrade - everything depends on man.
If that honest man, then he be honest man.
And he will do not rip audio for p2p trading.
But if this dishonest man, he don't need special ripping software. He will record it using standard windows accessories from standard Stereo Mixer.

Software is not guilty.

All of your hates of ripping software like iRadio is only to people. But not exactly to software.
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Old 20th May 2004, 21:28   #17
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well the problem is that those software help those who hurt us. Especially when they forge information.
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Old 21st May 2004, 01:12   #18
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Hey KXRM - sorry for being a pain bro, everytime I start the station, the ip keeps trying to connect:

<05/20/04@21:12:46> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting
<05/20/04@21:12:47> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting
<05/20/04@21:12:49> [dest: 218.82.97.90] server unavailable, disconnecting

How do I get rid of this?

Thanking you for your advice.
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Old 21st May 2004, 06:23   #19
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Log into the admin panel of the Shoutcast DNAS server and ban the IP. What you're seeing isn't really a big deal, it just shows someone is trying to connect and your stream isn't up yet. Even after banning them they may continue to attempt to connect for awhile but eventually they will go away.

If it's a major deal I'd advise in both banning the IP in the server and change the active port although this move would effect other listeners as well until they get used to the new port.

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Old 21st May 2004, 13:46   #20
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Thanx Rob - when somebody listens for nearly 12 hours must be either a Classic Rock Junkie, or is ripping the Program.
(anti - "streamripping")....i know I'm really powerless to do anything about it.

Thanx for your advice!
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Old 21st May 2004, 17:50   #21
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there really is no behavioral science to it, you would be surprised at some of the reasons people could be listening that long.
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Old 21st May 2004, 18:38   #22
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i have people that listen from the minute they get to work till the time they leave

only to tune back in when they get home and leave it playing

love those kinda listeners

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Old 21st May 2004, 20:41   #23
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That's true - thanx to all for your replys.
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Old 24th May 2004, 02:46   #24
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Ok seriously, we are getting this music for free anyway, so what is the difference if I listen to it now or half an hour later after I have "ripped" it while I was gone? It's nothing illegal in any way, because it's not like I'm going and selling it for a profit, or that I'm getting anything for free that I shouldn't (i.e. The music is already there, I'm just listening to it at a later time)
This whole debate just stems from everyone who downloads music illegally and burn it to CD's or whatever. I would feel no guilt whatsoever if I "ripped" a half an hour of music from a shoutcast station and then listened to it later.
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Old 24th May 2004, 03:26   #25
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Quote:
Originally posted by yesman567
Ok seriously, we are getting this music for free anyway,
I wish.

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Old 24th May 2004, 03:28   #26
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take our word for it. streamripping is illegal (depending on the music being broadcasted), immoral and just plain wrong.
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Old 24th May 2004, 22:02   #27
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Quote:
Originally posted by Vchat20
take our word for it. streamripping is illegal (depending on the music being broadcasted), immoral and just plain wrong.
Talking about just plain wrong!!! I can only support a few connections, usually just 3 so I have some bandwidth leftover for me... and I just caught someone eating ALL 3 of my SLots!!!!! he had 3 different client s/w connected.

Name: ool-182eedfa.dyn.optonline.net
Address: 24.46.237.250

Ban him from your servers for the next hour!!!! I know He'll just reboot. This is like the 5th time I've had a streamripper from the optonline.net

Check this out... they offer "free custom radio"

http://www.optonline.net/Registratio...n=%2Ffreeradio

Bob
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Old 24th May 2004, 22:42   #28
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yesman567 -

If all you require is a time shift, can I suggest you use an output recorder instead. This doesn't use up extra slots and upset the small guys and doesn't create any arguments.
I mainly use this for stations that don't send track info so I can pick it up from the DJ.

UJ
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Old 25th May 2004, 00:29   #29
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Haha I don't even streamrip, I just think it's dumb that these people think its sooo wrong... I AM getting this music for free anyway, and if you're paying for it, you're getting screwed over my friend... Shoutcast stations are free.
But what would the difference by between an output recorder and a program that records the stream directly? It's not like a program should need more than one connection to pick up a stream, so unless I'm mistaken, it wouldn't make much of a difference...
And as for the immoral claim... That is completely subjective to who you're talking to. I personally see no way that anyone is losing anything from someone recording and then playing later, so don't tell me what's right and wrong. The world is going to hell anyway, why not take it while you can? ;-)
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Old 25th May 2004, 02:51   #30
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what an idiot.

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Old 25th May 2004, 09:23   #31
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Quote:
Originally posted by yesman567
Haha I don't even streamrip, I just think it's dumb that these people think its sooo wrong... I AM getting this music for free anyway, and if you're paying for it, you're getting screwed over my friend... Shoutcast stations are free.
You miss the entire point. I could careless if somebody was recording for listening later... but to use 2 or 3 connections to do this is wrong.

AND I do have to pay for my content. OTR programming at decent quality is not free. I recently paid $70 to have an old 16" transcription disc cleaned up and tranferred to CD, so I could add it to my playlist. Normally I'm spending $15 to $20/month to add programs.

NOR is running a ShoutCast station free. The software is free... but there is the time and energy put into running a station. I spent 4 hours Sunday editing id3 tags so they would have a consistent look.
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Old 25th May 2004, 21:28   #32
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I guess you meant 2 kinds of rippers.

1. Ripper - machine.
2. Ripper and listener at the same time.

Stream ripping is not illegal if you keep it on your HDD and do not copy anywhere.

I think that type "2" of rippers is not bad for radio stations owners. But type "1" is real enemy.
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Old 25th May 2004, 21:30   #33
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either way we can't distinguish the difference at the server because they use the same software typically. This is likely due to the fact that they are uninformed about just how bad they are being by using the poorly designed software.
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Old 25th May 2004, 21:44   #34
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if you are hellbent on ripping streams, just ask the station manager if you can rip their station. of course, most will say no, but their are a random few that will let you rip it no problem.
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Old 25th May 2004, 22:11   #35
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I get e-mails from people telling me that the rip my stream to burn it on cd and listen to that in their cars...
They say: in this case i'm able to listen to your station allways...

So what's good and what's not...you hardly can control that.As long as nobody rips my stream to use my music to drive his own station or sell it, i think it's not a big problem.I'll make it harder to use pro automation software so the music crossfades,and add voiceovers and sweepers into the playlist.

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Old 26th May 2004, 02:08   #36
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Alright, does anyone listen at ALL here? I AM NOT a station owner, I WAS NOT referring to running a station, and I DON'T DOUBT that you have to pay for the music... BUT I DON'T! I was saying that *I* will get it for free either way, so what's the difference if I listen to it now or later? I frankly do not care how much you spend on music and/or operating costs as long as I don't have to pay for it. That is all that I meant by "Free"
Now, like I said, I DO NOT "streamrip" and I don't really have anything I NEED to listen to later, I am just wondering how saving a stream is any different from listening to the station in realtime.
And I am glad I never listen to any of your stations, you all don't deserve listeners for being so damn bitter.
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Old 26th May 2004, 02:15   #37
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problem is, its more or less based on trust. sure some people will save it and listen to it later in a legit manner. but you dont know that. you dont live with them. theres quite a number of people out there who will rip it and either share it on numerous p2p's, sell it, etc..

so alot of station owners just play it safe and ban any rippers that come along.
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Old 27th May 2004, 12:32   #38
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I take issue with guys who connect like this... tying up 2 slots. I went thru my logs and he was using combinations of RealAudio/jetAudio and WinAMP2.9/JetAudio near simultaneously for several days:

<05/24/04@17:07:00> [dest: 24.46.237.250] starting stream (UID: 5)[L: 2]{A: jetAudio}(P: 1)
<05/24/04@17:07:15> [dest: 24.46.237.250] starting stream (UID: 6)[L: 3]{A: WinampMPEG/2.9}(P: 2)
<05/24/04@17:11:06> [dest: 24.46.237.250] connection closed (245 seconds) (UID: 5)[L: 2]{Bytes: 992499}(P: 1)
<05/24/04@17:11:06> [dest: 24.46.237.250] starting stream (UID: 7)[L: 3]{A: jetAudio}(P: 3)
<05/24/04@17:11:56> [dest: 24.46.237.250] service full, disconnecting
<05/24/04@17:12:10> [dest: 24.46.237.250] connection closed (65 seconds) (UID: 7)[L: 2]{Bytes: 81920}(P: 3)
<05/24/04@17:12:12> [dest: 24.46.237.250] starting stream (UID: 9)[L: 3]{A: jetAudio}(P: 1)
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Old 29th May 2004, 00:39   #39
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I agree, these guys that take up two and three slots are just plain selfish. I have had people rip my streams and they switch from my two different bit rates. Let's be honest, all of us who run our stations care about the music we play, and the content that is in our station. We take pride in setting up our broadcasts so that listeners will enjoy our broadcast. If you want to rip the stream then why not just go to Kazzaa or Limewire and download it that way instead of taking up slots that belong to real listeners. Let me put it in terms some of you that think this is o.k. to do will understand. If you personally take the time and effort to create a business, a niche and you are doing well, and someone comes in one night breaks into your office and steals your plans, wouldn't you feel violated? Especially when a few months later they start up the same business and cut in to your customer base!
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Old 29th May 2004, 19:02   #40
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I own a station, and dont have a problem with people streamripping - i always notice people doing it - and if people want to listen to a show at a later time, like if they go out, then whats the problem? And if people do share the shows on kazaa, then who cares as long as they are not making a profit from our work?
However, I cant understand why people would need to take up 3 slots - this would annoy me, but its not exactly hard to ban an IP.

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