Old 12th December 2007, 23:04   #1
and1k
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Help [Juiced 2 runs slow]

Juiced 2 is running very slow for me. I have the minimum requirements or better (e.g. my video card is mentioned on the back of the box as recommended)

Specs:
XP SP2
AMD Athlon 64 X2 Dual Core 4800
2GB RAM
ATI Radeon X1900 w/512MB RAM (I believe - if it's important I can check)
Windows installed on C - 9.99 GB, 4.94 GB Free.
Juiced 2 installed on G - 455 GB, 412 GB Free.
PageFile running from G - Custom size (2-4 GB)
Windows and Juiced2 and the page file are running from a SATA HD.

Downloaded the latest ATI drivers about an hour ago.

Anything else you need me to tell you, just ask.

When I go into a race, the framerate is excellent, then suddenly drops out probably below 5 fps, definitely below 10. This normally happens at the worst possible time, like in the middle of a powerslide. I'm running on the lowest resolution (800x600) and I've turned off antialiasing and turned down the graphical fanciness as much as possible, which helps slightly.

Any helps would be appreciated.

Edit: I ran Task Manager in the background and it showed that the CPU usage was at 100% for most of the game. I don't know how that compares with other titles, but it might be worth noting.

What the box says for CPU is: 3.0GHz Pentium HT or equivalent (minimum) or Core Duo/AMD (Recommended)

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Old 13th December 2007, 20:54   #2
P$ycHo™
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defrag both your HDs, maybe that helps. perform a virus check.
Hope this helps you.
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Old 14th December 2007, 05:09   #3
Atmo
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It looks like your hardware should be able handle it.

The first thing i'd try is to make sure all your drivers are up to date. In particular your video card, sound card and chipset. While you're at it, install AMD's dual core optimizer patch from
here.
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Old 23rd December 2007, 12:28   #4
and1k
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Thanks all, I've downloaded the updates you recommended, but it's still running like a dog.

Any more ideas?

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Old 23rd December 2007, 18:22   #5
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From what I've found on the 'net about the game's requirements, you're only running better than minimum and slightly below recommended(X1950 is recommended). It should still run fine though. Try turning off anti-virus stuff when you play the game. If you run too many programs at once your game will suffer a bit.

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Old 23rd December 2007, 19:33   #6
P$ycHo™
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is your system clean? do you have many stuff installed? that can really slow your computer down. a fresh windows is sometimes faster.
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Old 24th December 2007, 21:12   #7
and1k
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Quote:
Originally posted by P$ycHoâ„¢
is your system clean? do you have many stuff installed? that can really slow your computer down. a fresh windows is sometimes faster.
Everything that I have installed on this computer is for games. I don't run AV or firewall, because I don't need to (it's not online) and the only additional software that I've installed that might slow it down slightly is SP2... which Juiced2 needs.

edit: @ deeder7001: They must have changed that video card recommendation since my box was printed then

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Old 31st December 2007, 10:47   #8
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Do the slowdowns come as new geometry/textures appear on the screen?

Your system is plenty powerful, but 10fps is pretty bad if you are turning everything down. Low res textures are not much more expensive than flat shaded tris on todays hardware... usually turning texture quality to minimum on any game will net the best perfomance increase.

It could be that ATI have not yet implemented a feature properly and so it is being run in software by the driver (I had this problem with nVidia's GeForce drivers about 2 years ago)! In which case you would just have to wait, however another user posts regarding the same problem... but has an nVidia card...

CPU speed of 100% doesn't indicate much. An infinite empty loop will do that, it will do it better than a loop that does something most of the time.

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Old 2nd January 2008, 20:40   #9
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Quote:
Originally posted by jheriko
Do the slowdowns come as new geometry/textures appear on the screen?
It doesn't seem to be related to anything in particular on screen... It seems to be more an issue with something in the car physics (like trying to powerslide through certain corners or something like that...)

Quote:
Originally posted by jheriko
Your system is plenty powerful,


Quote:
Originally posted by jheriko
but 10fps is pretty bad if you are turning everything down.
Everything is on minimum. I don't think it helped much to change the resolution, but turning off some of the graphical fanciness seems to have gone a bit towards fixing it. (There are 3 sliders in the pause menu, I can't remember what they do right now though!)

Quote:
Originally posted by jheriko
Low res textures are not much more expensive than flat shaded tris on todays hardware... usually turning texture quality to minimum on any game will net the best perfomance increase.
I think that's what I did...

Quote:
Originally posted by jheriko
It could be that ATI have not yet implemented a feature properly and so it is being run in software by the driver (I had this problem with nVidia's GeForce drivers about 2 years ago)! In which case you would just have to wait, however another user posts regarding the same problem... but has an nVidia card...
Good to know it's not just me then...

Do you mean that the GPU doesn't support, say, a certain type of shader, so the driver's handing that off to the CPU?

Quote:
Originally posted by jheriko
CPU speed of 100% doesn't indicate much. An infinite empty loop will do that, it will do it better than a loop that does something most of the time.
Hmmm.

The response I got from the lovely people at THQ said that I need to get a faster processor, despite the fact that it's labelled as a 4800, and (because) it does more instructions per clock cycle than an equivalent-speed Pentium... right?

They also said to update my drivers

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Old 3rd January 2008, 12:27   #10
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Quote:
Originally posted by and1k
Good to know it's not just me then...

Do you mean that the GPU doesn't support, say, a certain type of shader, so the driver's handing that off to the CPU?
Pretty much. The example I had was using depth textures, using them switched to software rendering, i.e. the CPU doing some of the work, in the end rather than wait for a fix I hacked it up to work with RGB8 and a custom shader... after they fixed it another driver update broke the damned thing


Quote:
Originally posted by and1k

Hmmm.

The response I got from the lovely people at THQ said that I need to get a faster processor, despite the fact that it's labelled as a 4800, and (because) it does more instructions per clock cycle than an equivalent-speed Pentium... right?

They also said to update my drivers
Yeah, the way that AMDs are "better" than Intels is a lot more nebulous than that. Typically the instructions take the same amount of clock cycles in theory, but other concerns like cache and instruction scheduling have an impact. Typically Intel's will out perform AMDs at brute force operations, e.g. a trillion additions on an Intel CPU will often run faster then the same trillion on an AMD. Higher clock speeds count for a lot when it comes to running intense applications, hence I have always had a strong dislike for the AMD fancy number scheme... its deceptive. Still your CPU is very powerful... and from what you describe about physics it does sound like it is the bottleneck.

To me though it sounds like yet another game failing to provide good options for performance tweaking and wasting CPU cycles on things you can't turn off... not that that helps any.

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Old 3rd January 2008, 12:53   #11
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It seems AMDs memory controller architecture is the primary contributor to the efficiency of their CPUs over Intel. The clock cycle counts don't seem to vary that much at all, esp for the common instructions (add, mul, mov, jmp etc..) and a lot of the vectored instructions are very tight too...

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Old 6th January 2008, 13:23   #12
and1k
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Quote:
Originally posted by jheriko
To me though it sounds like yet another game failing to provide good options for performance tweaking and wasting CPU cycles on things you can't turn off... not that that helps any.
That's about what I was thinking.

If another game (in a few years, probably ) needs me to upgrade, I'll do it then. Until then, Juiced2 can gather dust on a shelf

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Old 6th April 2008, 16:08   #13
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I ran dxdiag, went to the sound tab and turned off hardware acceleration. Problem solved. Except that to play other games I have to go back and turn it on again. Makes me think the problem is with the game.
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Old 11th August 2008, 12:11   #14
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Thanks bobmid! That fixed the problem...

The only problem now is that dxdiag doesn't recognise the soundcard at all... Oops!

Any ideas?

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Old 11th August 2008, 19:33   #15
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@bombid: cant you just turn hardware acceleration off ingame? on most games you can i think.
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