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Old 23rd January 2002, 01:46   #41
UnConeD
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I've been thinking about coupling it with a DSP plug-in that captures synchronised audio. Haven't tried anything yet, but I'm going to do some more APE-stuff once I'm finished with my current exams :P
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Old 23rd January 2002, 07:02   #42
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OK, weird idea. I only thought of this because Windows Media Encoder does the same thing. If APE's can make calls to any arbitrary DLL, then this will work.

As soon as you start reading frames with the APE, have it start a process in a DLL that captures the audio via the soundcard WaveIn feature. This is analog and probably sounds like a cheap fix, but the advantage is that you could capture anything Winamp is playing if the correct recording source is selected (CD, WAV, MP3, MIDI...)

The only problem here is latency involving WaveIn and the fact that the frame grabber will have to somehow get the recorded audio from the DLL once it becomes available. Sounds like fun (you know, the kind of fun that usually happens after the frustration part).

Another neat feature this could add is the use of ACM's to encode and compress audio data, or leave it PCM.
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Old 23rd January 2002, 08:24   #43
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apes, syncing

.ape files go in the avs folder.

syncing avis to music, i've had success here by putting in an effect that visibly reacts to sound- for instance a 'simple' oscilloscope- which will make a discernable pattern the instant you press 'play'. you then have a visible marker to place the beginning of your sound track to in premiere. (don't think virtualdub can do this). of course you may not want this effect at the beginning of your sequence. so you can either blank the beginning of the output movie (and turn off the osc as fast as possible) or else make up a version of your soundtrack with a dummy section at the BEGINNING.

t
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Old 23rd January 2002, 10:51   #44
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WaveIn

Not all soundcards supports recording of its own output. Not to mention that's it's pretty silly to have it go through the card first. A DSP plugin provides you with first-class access, plus it integrates with Winamp. It's probably the best solution.
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Old 25th January 2002, 09:34   #45
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unconed: is realtime rendering required? for an avi of avs with sound it wouldn't required to run in realtime i think, question is, if that's possible on the technical side.

btw: i'm yathosho (http://yathosho.deviantart.com)
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Old 25th January 2002, 14:22   #46
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Thanx UnConeD and Times2

I was sitting here, just wondering over the last few days how to do that avs-avi thingy and lo and behold two wonderful fluffy people up with a similar solution (I am reminded here of the Theory of Evolution and menes!!!), THANKYOU.
Basically I wanted it, as I use my own 3D animations through the avs as a live filter beat match unit/channel. But now I can grab these and slap them back onto the 3D objects, rerender the animations, put them back through the avs, and hey presto, even more fractal psychedelic imagery to help bend peoples heads at parties. Cheers again folks, and respect.
On a side I have had a few problems with playback speeds using avi's in the avs, and wondered if anyone else had any problems. I can get a reasonable frame rate with 320*240 stuff, which is alright for TV, but as I am starting to use data projectors at gigs (yes I am a VJ-sic sic sic) I wanted to take advantage of the higher resolution capacity. I have found even with 1+ Ghz computers with all the add-ons such as Matrox cards 512 ram and stuff, with any avi's higher than this (such as 640*480) the frame rate drops to an unacceptable level-5/6fps. Normally I need 15-20fps, similar to TV, as this is the "speed" at which it becomes possible to "fool" one's visual cortex, and also insert additional subliminal content. Has anyone had any greater success at finding perhaps the right combination? Or do I have to write an new avi player APE.
Lots of love, light, levity and a little liminality

P.s. I also am doing Free Video CD of my work, check out www.TranceVisuals.com if you are interested, and send me an email and I will post one out to you.
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Old 25th January 2002, 18:42   #47
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The basic reply is "It's AVS, AVS is slow, deal with it." .

If you search around the forum, you'll find numerous questions from people with shiny new systems wondering why AVS won't perform better on their system.

Because it's 100% CPU based *and* performs way more complex stuff than your average 3D card, you won't get any resolution close to what most people expect these days. Nothing to do about it, other than learn how to simplify and optimize presets, so you squeeze out the most FPS.

Perhaps upscaling a 400x300 picture can still lead to acceptable results?
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Old 28th January 2002, 12:25   #48
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Have you tried using the Disk Writer Output plugin?

UnConeD: I would like to put an image into avs and stretch it to a shape shown below.

***______
*.'***********'.
¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯¯

The reason I ask this is because I want to make an avs prest that looks like Super Mario Kart which was on the snes.
Attached Images
File Type: gif mario circuit 1.gif (97.2 KB, 207 views)
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Old 28th January 2002, 18:55   #49
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Diskwriter outputs as fast as it can, so you'd never get a synchronised audio-track. Plus I'm thinking about something that's easier to use and synchronises with my AVSGrabber automatically.
I will try this in a week or two, but not now due to lack of time. Maybe times2 can try it with his.

As far as your mario-kart thing is concerned, I doubt it'll work. The image is way too large and rendering it in AVS will reduce the resolution a lot. And if you want to do a convincing mario kart effect, you'll have to make a 3D planar projection along with a camera that follows and aligns itself to the track. Not so easy.
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Old 29th January 2002, 08:05   #50
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why does evry1 want visuals+sound, i just use the grabber 2 preview some shit and if i want sound to it i use a app i have.

batman
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Old 29th January 2002, 08:42   #51
times2
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sound

montana: still coming across like a 12 year old!

the reason I want to record sound is to be able to make a record of sound-reacting visuals. if I was to put some arbitrary sound on, the visuals wouldn't be reacting with the sound, would they? or what do you use AVS for? looking at your mommas holiday snaps?

unconeD: I have been doing some experiments with both grabbers, would I be correct in saying that your plugin writes consecutive frames to the avi file without considering when they were grabbed? or how does your 'sync with avs' feature work? I've found that my plugin syncs better when the music is dubbed back on.

I think to make an automatic grab-the-sound-as-well system, There needs to be a custom WINAMP plugin which is in communication with the .ape program. The problem is, what kind of plugin? If its an output plugin, I think you won't be able to hear the sound unless it also handles that itself..? Unless another class of plugin (general purpose?) can get access to the sound data?

I know external programs can communicate with apes (as PPs visfrac does this) but I don't know how to go about this. And I won't have time to look into it for another week or so...

For now I'm happy with the results I'm getting by putting in an effect that allows me to easily identify when the sound started and then dub it on afterwards.

BTW: another tip for anyone who's doing this. If you're recording typical quarter-screen AVS movies (say 320x240 or 352x288) and then blowing them up for output to fullscreen video (either in software usinf virtualdub etc OR in hardware using your graphics cards fullscreen overlay) they look A LOT better if you save them uncompressed when small, and blow them up BEFORE compressing them with indeo, mpeg or divX etc. This is because compressed files store pixel data in YUV411, YUV420 or similar formats, effectively meaning that the resolution of the colour information is HALVED or QUARTERED. So you're better off blowing up first, otherwise the colour signal of your movie is effectively only 160x120 or less and you get very blurry edges on high-contrast coloured shapes.

BTW another tip: mpeg4 v3 is by far the best quality codec in a given amount of data, that i've seen.

PS UnconeD: hows the exams going?

T
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Old 29th January 2002, 09:01   #52
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times2: u call me a 12-year old, what's up with that?

i grab the visual (while reacting 2 music)
and then i add the song on the avi with a little app i have

batman
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Old 29th January 2002, 17:02   #53
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(offtopic)
Montana:
Hate to make this personal, but in another thread (AVS vs. Milkdrop) you found it necessary to talk about '3D shit' and 'u MD'ers' as well.
Writing texts like that makes you look like a 12-year old.

Most people who want to have an interesting discussion take the time to write out full sentences with correct grammar. And not 'talk shit lik dis 2 so they soundz wayy l33t'. It's got nothing to do with being snobby, but just simple communication skills. No-one is forcing you to change your typing habits, but don't complain if it affects someone else's view on you.

Not to mention the fact that your two last posts to this thread said exactly the same, aside from the comment on times2 observation. He also didn't say you were a 12-year old, he said you came across as a 12-year old.
(/offtopic)


Now on to the actual useful discussion. AVSGrabber doesn't drop frames... how exactly does your grabber achieve this? Does it have a separate AVI saving thread that runs alongside render() and just fetches the current data when it's done with an old frame? I didn't really bother since the AVI saver slows down your PC in general, so AVS as well. Does it make a difference?

As far as 'Sync with AVS' is considered, I thought the UI was pretty clear on that though: It only applies to the playback rate (FPS)... if it's checked, the FPS will automatically be synchronized with AVS so you don't have to enter it manually.
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Old 29th January 2002, 19:20   #54
Montana
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[offtopic]
i'm sick & tired of y'all dissin' my way of typing, i wite like this all the time, i can write in perfect sentences but i only do that in my english class (i got a A+ in english). ok i use a lot of of profanity, but hey, that's me, ignore me if you don't like me

i am 18 not 12 in any sence,
i say it in english to you for the last time.
do i make my point clear?
[/offtopic]

batman
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Old 30th January 2002, 14:48   #55
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so montana: what part of harlem are you from, anyway?

seriously though. i'd be interested to know how well your 'previewed shit' syncs with the sound you've dubbed with the 'app i have'. because as far as i can tell, it couldn't.

unconed: the way i'm saving the avi is, first i check if avs is onto a new frame (based on the framerate chosen). then i'm saving the new frame with the framenumber based on when it was grabbed, not just consecutively. so the frame displays at the right time, although its possible to drop frames if you choose too high a rate (which is how it should be)...

T
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Old 30th January 2002, 20:33   #56
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(different discussion)
Montana: Oh come on... typing kewlz language that y'all be dissin' cos yer 2 kewl has got to be harder than typing normally. Why not prove you have more language skills than a peanut and type like everyone else? Do you think that writing like that will make hollow comments and useless posts sound any more interesting? Of course, dropping the act would prove my point, and we'd all have a good laugh at your expense. Again, you don't have to change, as long as you'll just accept our comments on your rediculous language use, which you don't. You're acting like a 12-year old
PS: Want to guess *my* age?
(/different discussion)


Quote:
unconed: the way i'm saving the avi is, first i check if avs is onto a new frame (based on the framerate chosen). then i'm saving the new frame with the framenumber based on when it was grabbed, not just consecutively. so the frame displays at the right time, although its possible to drop frames if you choose too high a rate (which is how it should be)...
So you increase the value of the framecount (2nd parameter to AVIStreamWrite) so that it corresponds with the actual FPS rather than the set FPS? I didn't really

hey dude u mean u like
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Old 30th January 2002, 21:11   #57
Montana
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times2: for crying out loud do this:
first take a cool preset,
grab the preset to avi (while music playing),
then take a song and convert it 2 wav and
use virtualdub and add the wavfile on the video,
that's simple.

[offtopic]
Montana38 aka Antanios Masud aka Tony Montana aka Superugly
is born & raised in Sodertalje, Sweden
[offtopic]

batman
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Old 30th January 2002, 21:19   #58
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Re: AVS to AVI , PLEASE MAKE THIS HAPPEN FINALLY

Quote:
Originally posted by ZeroZero
Me2 wanna record AVS to AVI, directly. Now I use Hypercam, but the quality is not very good, although I have fast 'puter and raid 0 hdd's. Come on u kewl nerds make this one (I read AVS-grabber or whatever) finally. THNX

why wouldanyone want to do this in the first place
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Old 30th January 2002, 23:57   #59
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Quote:
why wouldanyone want to do this in the first place
Umm... let's see...

Number of downloads:
avsgrabber.zip 115

If you take times2's grabber into account as well, that would be about 230 downloads.

Ask those 230 people
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Old 31st January 2002, 09:48   #60
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unconeD: was your mail trunctated?

I invoke 'AVIStreamWrite' with the 'lStart' parameter set to the frame number that the frame should be played at rather than just numbering them sequentially. which is the only way to make it sync.


montana: so your secret is to lower your standards until you've already met them! its obvious from your description that the nearest you could sync it would be the time it would take from you pressing 'play' in winamp to pressing 'save' in grabber.... as vdub cannot seperately trim inpoin ts on video vs. audio.... so i ask you again. did the movie you made looked synced?
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Old 31st January 2002, 11:05   #61
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Yeah it was truncated, but you only missed the Montana-ized version of my reply Don't know why... my internet connection was acting up yesterday.

Will try the synching thing... my last exam is tomorrow so I'll have plenty of time for AVS'ing/APE'ing after that
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Old 31st January 2002, 11:20   #62
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unconeD: update 4 sure, i'm getting good syncing with my saver as it is, (using 512x384@25fps with simple compositions) but i'd like to see [maybe by pooling talents] a saver that can save sound synced etc...

my wishlist [when i get time... week after next]

1) faster saving [direct binary transfer]
2) sound as well
3) start and stop when the song playback starts and stops?
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Old 31st January 2002, 14:20   #63
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times2: yeah it looks synced,
i play the song while grabbing the preset
and then adding the song as a wave-file in vdub
it works, do it yourself

batman
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Old 12th March 2002, 04:16   #64
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Awsome Job guys

I came here looking for a way to convert avs to avi, and Times2 and the other guy were on top of it. I just finished using both and they work perfect. This kinda thing should have a price tag on it..
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Old 12th March 2002, 14:59   #65
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well aint there supposed to be a link somewhere??

I am the one Armed Man in the Grassy knoll
I run a Non-Profeit Organisation that makes Coisters.
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Old 13th March 2002, 16:17   #66
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Use your head scarface/blurpak
Download here - http://avs.acko.net/?view=0

Looks good i'm about to try it.
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Old 13th March 2002, 20:20   #67
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how am i supposed to know where it was?
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Old 13th March 2002, 20:30   #68
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It's on the first page of this thread...
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Old 14th March 2002, 08:53   #69
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Having *a bit* programming experience i thought up the following:

Why don't you write a programm that uses a ape and a dsp plug to spy out the audio and video data? it should be synchron this way.
Furthermore it should be able to record more than one avs-pre and even the transition as long as the spy.ape is included in the avs-pre's you use. would be great...
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Old 14th March 2002, 09:31   #70
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Magic.X:
Quote:
(UnConeD) I've been thinking about coupling it with a DSP plug-in that captures synchronised audio. Haven't tried anything yet, but I'm going to do some more APE-stuff once I'm finished with my current exams :P
I don't think an APE can capture transitions though... when transitioning, AVS calculates each frame of both presets, and applies the transition filter afterwards. Because the APE's are both inside the presets, they will get a regular frame, not one with the transition filter.
Also, each instance of an APE is a separate object. So when switching presets, all the data in the APE will be lost (like the handle to the AVI file) so the other APE in the next preset can't just continue on where the other left off. Sorry, but that's the way AVS works. The alternative would be a program that capture the AVS window externally. This would mean that the window has to be completely on top and it would make synching harder, but it would allow capturing of AVS transitions. Of course, this would require a totally different approach to AVSGrabber, which means a partial rewrite.
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Old 14th March 2002, 10:03   #71
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[IDEA] How about recording the overlay signal??? on my pc, th overlay is recognized as a video stream and cn be sent to TV out without any performenc loss. it must be possible to record it! adding sound would be an easy task aferwards... [/IDEA]

[DIFFENT TOPIC]anyway, have you tested HOTLIST??? it's my first released avs tool, have a look on it: Download[/DIFFRENT TOPIC]
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Old 27th March 2002, 22:54   #72
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today i used unconed's plugin to save my avs as avi. i wanted to compress the avi in virtualdub or nandub, but it turned out that both tools could not open the avi-stream. i tried other players than windows media players and also tried some alternative video editing tools. the avi created by the ape has no sound-channel, which is why most tools can't open the avi. wmp seems to ignore this, but i guess it's somehow against the avis specs. maybe it's possible to add a silent soundchannel to the avis, try implementing this in a future version of your ape.

since i've seen your preview to whacko 4, i'm wondering what tool you used to compress your avis.
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Old 27th March 2002, 23:02   #73
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same problem appears with pixelcorp's avi-grabber
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Old 27th March 2002, 23:44   #74
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I had the same problem... I created an AVI with AVSGrabber which played just great in Media Player, but when I opened it in VirtualDub I got a message "Video data too short, expected nnnnnn bytes, got nnnnn bytes." or something like that.

Never found out what caused it, but after resetting my pc, the problem was fixed. In any case, it's not mine (or times2's) fault. Both APE's use Windows' standard AVI functions... it seems they contain a bug that can cause it to write corrupt AVI's sometimes . So sorry for the inconvenience, but it's not my fault.

VirtualDub has its own AVI routines (which allow it to read partial or slightly corrupt AVI files) but which seems to choke on this bug.
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Old 28th March 2002, 04:30   #75
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it works now! i used raw-mode, but i had to choose it from the menu to make it work properly. checking the box "raw-mode", created the problem i previouly described. nice ape, nice!
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Old 11th October 2007, 22:51   #76
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So it works now?
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Old 13th October 2007, 12:53   #77
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as mentioned above, it does. i only get a black video, unless i disable "get fps from avs". you should also disable overlay, otherwise you might also get a black video. for the record: i use foobar 0.8.3 with avsmod 0.3 (that is avs 2.81 iirc).
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Old 19th December 2007, 09:43   #78
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sorry to bring back such an old topic but are any of these APEs still about? all the links are dead (not surprisingly)
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Old 19th December 2007, 16:38   #79
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you can still download it @ http://acko.net/design/avs
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